Perhaps your suspension needs re-building/setting up or you need a better choice of tyre? worth considering before chopping and going to the other side!

 

Oh there is nothing wrong with the bikes handling, I just want a bike that is more reliable. I will have to sort the ST4S before I get rid of it anyway, but I am thinking about something to replace it.

John

 

What reliability issues have you been having, and can't they be sorted out?

 

Just look at my post for main bearings!!

John

 

The VFR 800 is well supported on the internet. I am sure you will get a good amount of information on a VFR specific site. I believe there are a number of current and former VFR owners here who could also provide some good feedback. They are very well liked bike world wide with a "cult" like following. The v-four sounds sweet too. I don't think the v-tec was all that well liked though. It would be a good alternative to the ST model line, if you don't mind the Star Trek movie prop looks. Not without their own issues like frying regulator recifiers, and difficult to access shims, ie iirc, the engine has to be lowered/rotated to access front cylinder heads. But, they are still Hondas, and for me, I know I would be left feeling "flat" after a year's ownership period, and then I'd be back, looking for "more." YMMV.

Re your reliability issues: I know that my view point is not appreciated by many, but based on what little I know, I believe there was a "run" of bad engines, ie faulty parts or assembly, during a certain production time, and unfortunately, you seemed to have one of them, if that indeed is the case. I can't fault you for being totally pissed-off. I would be too. But, the vast majority of ST's are fairly reliable bikes, believe it or not.

 

I owned 2000 VFR for a couple years, which is pretty much the same in power minus the vtec. At anything under 6k rpm the bike has very little thrust, kind of like a 600 sportbike. That's why I ended up selling it, while the ST2 is 20 peak hp less I consider it's 944 engine much stronger overall. I'd look at a Sprint as an alternative.

 

vfr

I love riding the ST4S, but it is really pushing me to my limit with it!! I am looking for an alternative.
John

John, VFR's are great bikes no doubt. The VFR owners I know look upon my ST4s with envy. Most ask if I want to trade rides for the next pass through the mtns. I generally refuse this saying "I can't afford top fix your bike if I wreck it, and I'm not sure if you could afford to fix mine." One guy I swap with on a regular basis though, bikes that is.

They're great bikes with sewing machine smoothness, good brakes and suspension, great handling. They have a wider powerband (ie less shifting) and pretty much do it all from track days to cross-country tours, like the ST4s.

However, the only advantage of a VFR over a ST4s I see is lower maintenance cost. It's pretty much add gas and change oil type of bike.

Both bikes require some ergonmic setup to fit the rider, both have a few owner quirks.

I'm not sure what you mean by "it is really pushing me to my limit with it".

If your riding skills exceed the ST4s, they'll exceed the VFR.

They are so much alike (imnsho) I don't think there is anything to gain by switching except the maintenance schedule

 

If you're used to Ducati servicing costs to adjust shims etc then the later VTEC costs won't be a shock to you.
Have you thought about Triumph 800 /XC just been admiring them at a garage in Edinburgh, tidy looking machine.

 

Don't get me wrong I love riding the 4S, I also have an ST2 which has been a fantastic bike and I have now passed it on to the girlfriend. I just have to say enough is enough, I cant keep throwing money at this bike!! If I can get it sorted out which I am trying to do then I may just change my mind. I think this bike has some real character and really puts a smile on my face, but it also makes me want to kick it around the garage!!

John

 

Get rid of this 4s and get as late a model as you can to replace it !
my 2002 4s had nearly 50,000 Mls on the clock with very little reliability issues which were not caused day me !

My latest is on just under 20,000 Mls and I expect it to easilly get to a similar milage and beyond as there is little on the market to rival it. A VFR is not going to float your boat after the thrust of a 4s either performance wise or handling and the latest Triumph ST1050 will not do it either (I know , I owned and sold one last year)

You could try the Kwak SX1000 but the handling is not getting the best of reviews...........or a Yamaha FZ1 which seems on the mobney for power , weight and handling.

I think you should get your current bike up and running and then give it a chance to redeem itself on the road , afterall any engine can throw a bearing its just a shame you seem to have got a Friday bike.

Stick with it , you know you want to

 

I had a unique oppurtunity to test ride an 07 ST3 back to back with a new, old stock, VFR 800. I planned on doing 80% 2 up as my wife wants to ride more. I have an 1198 for the solo stuff. The ST3 suspension was better for 2 up than the VFR, the VFR bottomed the center stand on the 1st mid corner bump I hit.

Also the low end 2 up was severely lacking, i just liked the low end and user friendly powerband of the ST3. Braking, I give the edge to the ABS VFR, but it was a "New" bike vs 20,000 mile ST3.

The experience convinced me another Ducati was the way to go and I picked up a very clean, 05 ST3 from my dealer in Albuqurque.

 

Just been looking at the Multi 1100s, they are starting to grow on me aswell!! Am I just asking for more trouble here?

John

 

You're asking if asking about any Multistrada in the ST section is asking for trouble? :abduct: Yes, you are asking for more trouble *here.*

From all accounts, if you can get past the looks, they're good bikes. Said to handle better than sport bikes in the twisties. Air cooled 2 valvers are pretty tough engines and easy to serve. Good grunt. IIRC there were some valve guide issues in the a/c desmoduos for a while.

 

I had a 99 VFR800Fi-X before the ST4s and it fucking broke my heart.

It had not been well looked after before I got it and I had major cooling issues, the water pump went, the charging system ate itself and the downpipes had been cobbled together from two different systems, neither which seemed to have been for a VFR.

But when I got it all sorted before I sold it, it wasn't bad.

The power and torque is nothing like the 4s, neither are the brakes or the suspension. It is a good bike, but altogether, it is a bit bland in comparison.

There can be well sorted examples about, but even with a filter, full system and a Power Commander, the best you'll see from them is about 110 at the wheel. It is very hard to coax more power from them.

The 4s is more distinctive, more powerful and handles better.

A

 

Personally, I wouldn't touch a vtec VFR. Possibly one of the stupidest ideas Honda ever had. 2 valves/cylinder operates until the other two kick in at around 6k rpm. This is supposed to give better low end power, which it doesn't - unlike the ST2's large valves, they are little bitty valves. Not only did it have no advantage to the previous cam-driven engine, it got worse mileage - it also made valve adjustments a nightmare comparatively. Epic fail all around, imo.
Why not look for a later model ST4s or ST3? or another ST2?

 

I understand that the Multi 1100 is a DS engine. One of my friends reported that his has the same problem of weak bronze valve guides reported in the MTS1000DS. http://www.ducati.ms/forums/11-ducati-motorcycle-chat/68144-bikes-affected-valve-guides.html

Personally, I don't know anything about the problem, but my undrstanding is that valves have been something of an issue on the 2-valve a/c engines intermittently, apparently because the 8mm valves cause greater wear with the higher mass than the 7mm valves of our 4-valvers. If I understand it correctly, the lack of a water jacket exacerbates the issue.

Ron

 

So it seems any bike i'm going to get it going to give me trouble at some point!! I might aswell try and sort the problems out on the ST4S! And then prey it is sorted out.

John

 

Thats the ticket , you know thats what you really wanted all along , you just needed reassuring...............!

 

i found the VFR boring and my ST4S a joy. Just miss the personality when I was on the VFR, kind of passionless.

 

I seem to have that idea about all the jap bikes to be honest. Anyway if i sort this one out I will know whats done to it. Better to do that than start from scratch maybe?

John

 

Hi guys

I have had 4 vfrs. Yes, four, one after another, from '90 rc36 to '05 VTEC, in between I had the rc46 fi model which has my personal record of 2 and a half years of ownership.

Talking about the rc46-2 "vtec", it is a much different bike than a ST. Suspension is simply "simplier" than ST, but believe me, does the job, specially if it is a vtec-abs version whith preload adjuster.
Brakes, really ST also is better, but CBS-SPORTS does the job. It took me a lot of time getting confident with unlinked brakes after 3 and a half years of "pressing the brake lever and the bike does it for you". Really brilliant for road and city use; don't be caught in "posh" thinkings that linked brakes are not cool.

Chasis and handling, vfr is easier to drive fast. Aluminium frame is delicious, easy to do cornering than the st. The lower gravity center help a lot and feels sporty.

Ergonomics Is one of the points which gave me to change the bike. handlebars where too low for me, windscreen too small and air buffeting was really disturbing me. Nothing you can do, neither putting taller screens, it simply doesn't work for me.

Engine and feeling Other point wich I can tell you st's are better. You have to drive like a 600 for less perfomance than a 600, but fuel costs and everything are like a 800. Vtec is funny but no real improvement, yes you feel a real punch but below 6500 / 7000 there is nothing but a slower bike.

Realibity Vfrs are the good bikes, well built but with well know problems. Rectifiers/Regulators like to burn itselves and alternators also. Wiring harnesses are poorly grounded and have gremlins, and camchain tensioners also fail often.
Ducatis are italian () so supposed to be non realiable bikes, but mine works quite ok unless some known problems solved with the fatduc.

So it depends really on you, go test a vfr, hear what she tells you, feel her, ride her, and take a decision. I can promise you they are special ladies, not the best in nothing but the second in everything

Sorry if its not understandable I am a poor spanish

 

John,

Sounds like you might have got yourself a lemon. If you like the ST line of bikes you might also just want to look at getting her going and then trade up for a newer model ST hopefully without the issues.

Good Luck either way......

 

Thanks for your opinion furylow, it was just a thought really. It seems any bike that I get is going to have its issues, I think I will take my time and battle on with the 4S and hope! that I get a good bike in the end. I have done lots of other stuff to her and I don't want to see that go to waste.

John

 

I know you don't want to hear this, but consider swallowing your pride and paying an experienced shop to do it. Not only will there be a better chance of success, you will get a guarantee with the work.
There are very few instances I would suggest paying a shop, this is one of them.

 

To be honest erik it's down to cost, if I could afford to spend £50 and hour I would just scrap the bike and buy a new one! To do the work again is going to cost me about £150 as I now have all the equipment ready, its just a case of the time. I will get it sorted in the end!! I just need to be 100% sure of my measurements this time.

John

 

I had an '01 VFR ran it 79k mi till bambi took it out.
Great everyday ride - relatively bullet proof 'cept for eating a regultor every 15k or so.

My ST3 is a vastly nicer ride; better susp, brakes and a good bit more power (termis, chip and a/box) - only had it 5k mi and 6 months so I can't comment on reliability yet.

My two cents: stick with a duc - try and ST3??

 

VFR vs ST4S

The one bike has a soul, the other doesn't!

 

The one bike has a soul, the other doesn't!

sometimes soul isn't needed

 

Stryder - Actually the journalist chose the VFR but you are right in that all the comparisons within the article suggested the ST was the better bike so was quite surprised at the verdict given , usual Honda bias.

Personally I have found the VFRs' I have ridden to be rather bland and when I did recently try another ST bike it was the Triumph not the VFR despite being available with better accessories. We eventually established the 1050 did not provide what we wanted from a bike so returned to the Ducati fold !

I would rather have something that I can connect with a few minor irritations than either a tuetonic or riseburner white noise ride - No offence intended to anybody but that is my preference.

 

Stryder - Actually the journalist chose the VFR but you are right in that all the comparisons within the article suggested the ST was the better bike so was quite surprised at the verdict given , usual Honda bias.

Oh okay, that's for clarifying that. I didn't read the article, just comments on it elsewhere which suggested the ST3 "won." It was at a Ducati friendly site so the poster was probbaly a little bias.

...I would rather have something that I can connect with a few minor irritations than either a tuetonic or riseburner white noise ride...

"white noise"