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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well, I'm sorry that it has taken soooo long to get this information to you guys but nothing was going to stand in the way of the correct proceedure of prototyping and testing.

My apologies in advance for anyone that was expecting a "two minute $10 bolt-up turbo kit" that offers 50hp increase, or a set of fancy throttle bodies or radically ground cams that will drain your wallet as quick as they drain your fuel tank.

What we (myself and Todd Patterson from Bunbury Dyno Centre) have done is designed a "Plug & Play" bellmouth, filters, PowerCommander, and installation kit that completely replaces the stock (severely restricted) Ducati airbox and filter system.
Stage1 of this kit is now available for all of the SportClassic/GT range that is currently running a Termigoni/DP ecu, ie: doesnt use the closed loop oxygen sensor system of the standard Ducati ecu.
This kit will also fit (and offer the same hp/Nm increases) to Hypermotard, and soon, the new 1100Monster but we need a test unit to generate the PowerCommander fuel map.

The story from the begining goes something like this.
I had been thinking for a long time about installing a PowerCommander and was also very interested in the oversize bellmouths that are on offer from different vendors.
What I wasnt keen on however, was that no one was offering a complete system that housed the PC3 + the two coils + mounting and instructions, let alone the fact that you had to generate your fuel map after everything is installed.

So, I approached Todd at Bunbury Dyno and told him what I planned on doing.
We very quickly organised a time to come down to the dyno and do a heap of base runs to evaluate future improvements.
I have posted the results of those base runs but will do so again thru the course of this post.
The first day of dyno testing (nearly 3 months and over 250 dyno runs ago)
was to measure output of the standard "as delivered" bike, ie: Ducati exhaust - Ducati standard airbox, lid, and filter - Standard Ducati ecu.
We then measure output of the Termigoni kit including baffles and the dyno graph below shows the (best runs selected) outcome of those tests and the base measurements from which we started our product development.
Included are photos of that stage of testing.






I have included a picture of the standard airbox configuration that we will all find under the tanks... Just incase some of you have not seen what it looks like. Note how the airbox structure carry's the coils (front not in pic) and also receives the engine and idle-air breather (not in pic).



We then went on to test the results of fitting pod filters direct to the throttle bodies before a heap of runs on a set of bellmouths that I had made so that they can be progressively cut down in length to document the effect on hp/torque relationship.




All that testing lead to a bloody long day on the dyno with the need for a fuel top up before continuing.
I wont publish the results of that series of dyno testing, but suffice to say, we have tried every combination of length vs torque vs hp and arrived at the most useable geometry for production.




Continuous testing of results based on surface finish have lead to a unique pattern in the inner surface of the bellmouths that seems to somehow mix the air/fuel in a manner that is more conducive to a smoother running engine.

Anyhow, I've reached the max number of pics in one post, so checkout the next installment for pics of the finished kit as it will be offered to the market.

Greg.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 · (Edited)
Pics of production kit

The pics below show the various components that are included in the complete stage1 kit.

All bracketry and fasteners are included and fittup is fully documented in a installation booklet with all colour photos.

I will add more to the story of development as this thread unfolds so feel free to ask any questions on this thread so all can benefit from the answers.

For thos who do not have a Termi/DP ecu - fear not as we are very close to an economic resolve in a reprogramme to your existing computer.

More later.

Greg.

Oh - I forgot to mention....
Typical with all products that I manufacture, there is absolutely NO modification require to your bike or any of it's existing components.
The entire kit could be removed and the bike taken back to manufacturers specs in a similar time to initial setup.
Installation time is about 1.5 > 2hrs with little to average mechanical skill and limited tools.






Pic 13 and 14 shows what your bike is currently breathing thru








As a side note - The first kit was installed on Gducks monoposto yesterday and after a 20min ride around Bunbury it took Garry a further 10mins to be able to remove his helmet... His smile was that big..
Garry also reported that he only just managed to remove his riding pants this morning due to similar swelling problems.

Greg.
 

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Please PM me cost, delivery timetable, shipping to Singapore etc

I have Biposto with termi's (baffles removed), DP ecu and lightened flywheel - otherwise stock (apart from Dietrichs air box cover.

Cheers,

Brett
 

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Excellent to see it in the flesh after all your hard work Greg, it is just as you described. The construction looks very professional and those bell mouths and filters are bad ass :cool:. Brilliant that there is now a complete package to pull it all together.

Do the smaller K&N filters also come with the kit? I am assuming that at least one of these is taking care of the crank case breather pipe?

Now for the million dollar question.... what is the total cost shipped to my place? I want to hear that intake! :D:D:cool:

Note to self -total cost of mods this year will soon require that I start researching the price for kidneys on the black market...
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Dyno sheets

Attached are the dyno results that we acheaived yesterday ON THE DAY....
I say on the day because atmospheric conditions of temperature, humidity etc will and do effect the outcome of such dyno results.

All graphs that we have and will show are the highest acheived peak runs for each configuration and not the lowest basic runs compared to our highest modified runs to make our product look better.

I have also included run 46 to show that even the same bike in the same configuration will achieve varying results on different days given different atmospheric conditions.
The difference is minimal but measurable non the less.

You can see that we have overlaid results from early tests in the configuration of:
Runfile# 009 - Standard bike
Runfile# 006 - Termigoni kitted bike
and Runfiles #46 and 127 - current Power-up kitted bike.

I belive GDuck will be reporting on his assesment soon and may post his graphs up for perusal.
His bike has different gearing at 14>38 so does show a slight difference at the final outcome but at more than 5hp gain and more importantly 5>6ft/lbs torque increase, he is one happy camper.



 

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The price? ol'mate, what's the price.
 

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Great Work

Great work Greg, before I pm you for a price and order, has this been done on a PC3 or PC5 with autotune and what's in store with stage 2 and 3?

Keep it up

Regards Nick:D
 

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Ok Greg...I have stock everything except some custom slipons and a FatDuc....and polished ceramic coated exhaust that i suspect does nothing except please me!

I have your BSB and Account details

What do we do from here?

Great work mate....done to the nth degree as promised/expected.

You have made my bike the best toy I have ever owned....well without your TMSD...it would have been on the scrap heap after the R1200RT...

It just needs more grunt to go with the handling...again not supplied as standard...but you and others have paved the way...great stuff...these are indeed great machines.

Oh that sound....just amazing...imagine if it went a bit harder...hmmm....

:D :) :D :) :D
 

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price?

is stage two going to be added to this system?

my hyper needs some new toys thrown at it.
 

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Just a quick question for clarity. Is your new bell mouth the grooved one in picture 10 or the one with the 'holes' used in pictures 15-18?
 

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Greg, my first question is: Do you recommend this kit before a front suspension upgrade, a wheel upgrade to tubeless wheels and a brake upgrade?
That is, would I need these other upgrades to fully appreciate what this kit will give me?
The posts are coming quicker than I can type, so if this is covered elswhere I don't expect I direct reply.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Please PM me cost, delivery timetable, shipping to Singapore etc

I have Biposto with termi's (baffles removed), DP ecu and lightened flywheel - otherwise stock (apart from Dietrichs air box cover.

Cheers,

Brett
Thank's for your interest Brett. I will send a pm in the next hour or so.

Do the smaller K&N filters also come with the kit? I am assuming that at least one of these is taking care of the crank case breather pipe?

Now for the million dollar question.... what is the total cost shipped to my place? I want to hear that intake! :D:D:cool:

Note to self -total cost of mods this year will soon require that I start researching the price for kidneys on the black market...
The kit is TOTAL "Plug & Play" - Yes, all filters are included and no mods are required at all.....:cool:

Will send a pm about p&a soon.

P.S - forget about the "Kidneys" mate - I've seen how you have abused them and they are not worth a two Bob (twenty cents for the benefit of all you foreigners).

The price? ol'mate, what's the price.
Thank's Chunk's - I will send a pm.

Great work Greg, before I pm you for a price and order, has this been done on a PC3 or PC5 with autotune and what's in store with stage 2 and 3?

Keep it up

Regards Nick:D
Comes complete with a pre-mapped (to suit your configuration) PC3 Nick.
I am sure the PC5 is not available for this (or any pre 09) engine.
If they make a PC5 for Hypers at a later date then we may be in luck.
Autotune is about the same cost again as PC.

Stage 2 will include the addition of a (info not yet ready for release) ecu that will have pre-mapped ignition advance features and will be retrofitable with stage1 kits.

Stage 3 will have the inclusion of a new style, kit enhancing full exhaust with stepped headers and upsized union/tail pipe diameter.

Ok Greg...I have stock everything except some custom slipons and a FatDuc....and polished ceramic coated exhaust that i suspect does nothing except please me!

What do we do from here?

Great work mate....done to the nth degree as promised/expected.

:D :) :D :) :D
Sounds like you are crashtestdummy (for want of a better term) for stage2.

price?

is stage two going to be added to this system?

my hyper needs some new toys thrown at it.
Will go straight onto a Hyper depending on your configuration.
We have a couple of local Hyper owners with their hands up as test pilots so the maps and configs are not far away.
We are looking forward to doing that.
Stage2 question answered above....

Just a quick question for clarity. Is your new bell mouth the grooved one in picture 10 or the one with the 'holes' used in pictures 15-18?
The holes shown in the later pictures showed a slight increase in performance in back to back runs.

Production will see the diameter of the holes reducing as they head towards the base, and there is another series of holes to be added at the bottom.

Many thanks guys,
Greg.
 

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How does it perform under dynamic conditions… dyno runs are one thing but there are definitely reasons for using airboxes to create quiet air…

Can you explain?
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Greg, my first question is: Do you recommend this kit before a front suspension upgrade, a wheel upgrade to tubeless wheels and a brake upgrade?
That is, would I need these other upgrades to fully appreciate what this kit will give me?
Dont worry about the front suspension upgrade Doug.
The wheel is going to be in the air with the kit fitted :D:D:cool::D:D:eek:;)

Na seriously mate... Get the thing handling fast speed before you make it go faster.

Greg.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
How does it perform under dynamic conditions… dyno runs are one thing but there are definitely reasons for using airboxes to create quiet air…

Can you explain?
Good question mate... I had to stop and think about whats going on during a ride.

Talking with GDuck today on the phone, I asked about his thoughts and any input he may have.

In a bit of a breif into how Garry and I ride... We are both quite aggresive riders who enjoy fast pace and getting the bikes quickly around corners and are generally right on each others tails during our sessions on the twisty's.
Thats how garry got a cracked headlight.:D
Garry is probably not as stupid as me and hardly ever lifts the front wheel where I enjoy doing just that as we exit corners, (or to be honest, anywhere).
We both know our bikes and it's/our capability's well and, like every one, never really adventured to the rev limiter as the bike stopped "pulling" well before then.

When asked for his input, Garry said he must admit that he had never touched the rev limiter on his bike..... BEFORE TODAY.....
With the kit fitted, there is little/no warning that the engine is nearing it's rev limit and the next thing you know, the limiter is telling you it's time to pick another cog.
Not only does the engine pull A LOT quicker up to max revs, but it pulls a lot harder as well. You find that when you are on the gas, gear changing is required far faster than you were previously used to.

When you are off the gas, things are no different than they used to be... Apart from maybe you dont feel as much "lugging" as was previously.
There are certainly no disadvantages of this kit fitted when riding in slow mo.

I cant comment on fuel efficiency as I never even thought about it previously let alone now.

If you are low on traffic infringment points (like me), this is probably not the mod for you....
Just because it's there, you dont have to use it.... But I find that each time I throw a leg over the bike now, I use it... Just because it's there.:cool:

Greg.
 

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Dont worry about the front suspension upgrade Doug.
The wheel is going to be in the air with the kit fitted :D:D:cool::D:D:eek:;)

Na seriously mate... Get the thing handling fast speed before you make it go faster.

Greg.
Thanks for the honest answer Greg, as if I expected anything else. Your TMSD has sorted the front end wobbles but I think I need tubeless wheels and better tyres as a minimum, to really feel confident pushing this bike. I'll definitely be paying you a visit once this is done, or on its way. I also hope your stage 3 exhaust system looks the business to match the performance, just like everything else you have done. Most of us have a thing about the look of our bikes, probably because nature hasn't been generous to us in various ways, you and me excepted of course.
 

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Looking forward to the (promised) data for the Arrows fitted PS.

BTW...what about the intake sound? Is it stoopid loud? My neighbours are cool, but I can't stand to wear earplugs when I ride and would like to keep what is left of my hearing.

Anyway very sexy stuff. I knew it was going to be an intake mod with fuel mapping. Curious to know if the WOT map is generally richer or leaner than what the DP ECU provides.

Really like where you mounted the PCIII. Nice.
 

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… dyno runs are one thing but there are definitely reasons for using airboxes to create quiet air…

Just for context, a very good Ducati tuner around here once told me that he had seen nothing but hp *losses* with pod filters since the introduction of f.i. I think that is the "quiet air" effect you are talking about, and it shows up (or at least some of it does) even on the dyno. So, as I understand it, if you are getting hp increases with pod filters on the dyno as Wasp is, then there is definitely something else going on, and it is not a typical result that one would expect from just filters and mapping.
 

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Looks great WASP!

I am a little confused as to what the kit includes? The kit requires the customer to have the Termi kit correct? How about a Power Commander? Does your kit included a PC or do we need it?

Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Looking forward to the (promised) data for the Arrows fitted PS.
(Promised) data is on its way...
Sunday morning we did a couple of dyno runs on the WASPmobile and then setup, and tuned GDucks bike with the full kit..
It wasnt untill we all turned our attention to the PS sitting in the corner that we realised the customer did not bring his rubber throttle body elbows into the shop.

This particular PS has (for the last two years) run pod filters straight onto the throttle bodies and achieved a consistent 94hp/70ft.lbs.
Once Todd gets hold of the customer to bring the elbows in, it will be run first with the original Termi 2>2 and then with the Arrows exhaust so that we end up with the two maps.

As soon as Todd does his thing (tomorrow hopefully) I will publish dyno results - Good, Bad, or indifferent.

BTW...what about the intake sound? Is it stoopid loud? My neighbours are cool, but I can't stand to wear earplugs when I ride and would like to keep what is left of my hearing.
The intake sound is something I think I could never get sick of.
As an example... My first SportClassic was the WASPmobile MK1 - Black monoposto, dry clutch etc...
I know it is sacrilege, but I found myself "over" the sound of the dry clutch to a point where I was pulling the clutch in at lights so I didnt have to listen to it.:eek:
The intake noise is different... You can deffinately hear it gasping for air at the 1/2OT but it's pleasant and non offensive or drone'ee.
At WOT the motor and exhaust are screaming to a point where it all works into a harmoniuos crisendo intime with the air that is being supplied.

Garry has commented that he can hear it quite distinctly but his helmet is as flogged out as Paris Hilton and, to be honest, you can hardly tell the difference from the sidelines.
I stood to listen to Todd on a testride one time and I had a hard time picking the diff.

Curious to know if the WOT map is generally richer or leaner than what the DP ECU provides.
Dunno mate - I would have to consult Todd on that one.

Really like where you mounted the PCIII. Nice.
Thank's - It's very purposefull in that it has the tuning connector points facing downwards and allows easy (no tank or seat removal) access for further work.

Greg.
 
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