[kel3at]

Recieved my full exhaust Fri and put it on Fri night. Here are a couple pics of the install. I started installing the exhaust around 7pm and finished by 1am. It wasn't too hard of a job, there were a couple bolts that were tough to get to. And there were no directions that came with the exhaust so I just had to wing it. I reset the TPS with the VDST software. After the install the TPS read 5.6, the software reset it back to 2.6.

You can feel a bit of a performance gain to the bike, the engine just feels like its working easier. The RPM's seem to climb faster too, and she is a louder when you get on the throttle. Idle noise is only slighty louder. As for the dreaded flat spot, it is still there though not as bad. There is no lurching anymore but the slight hesitation still exists. You can feel it, but with the better breathing I think the bike powers through the low rpms quicker and thus the flat spot is less of a problem.

 

[ds tiger]

wow - a full termi system on a NON S model- how "up-itty" of you!

Just kidding!


Looks cool- real cool, I like the way the pipe snakes down and under the rear cylinder- very beefy looking.

Nice write up. What did you do with the O2 sensors? I am assuming it came with ECU and air filter- no?

Also- what is the pipe made of (Ti, steel) ?

Thanks

 

[kel3at]

Race ECU and filter came with. Both O2 sensors are still used but the flapper valve, motor and cable get removed. I will have to look at the exhaust to see what it is made of, I really didn't pay attention. The exhaust pipes themselves are lighter in weight though than the stock system, but part of that is due to the flapper valve thingy.

 

[flynbulldog]

Why did you put the o2 sensors in?

 

[kel3at]

Because the holes are there so I assume that they must still be used, but I am new to these bikes. Is this true? Do I have to use them?

 

[TheDucnutOfBevelville]

looks like no improvement to the foot position???? or is it different?

 

[bucknut]

Thanks for the first look. My pipe is being installed this week and I am pumped! I Think we already know this but Ferracci said if the bike does not run better with the DP ECU I could put on a power commander that would allow him to tune at 50rpm intervals at all throttle openings. I told him just to go ahead and do it and he was reluctant, he said lets see how it runs with the DP ECU first.

 

[kel3at]

looks like no improvement to the foot position???? or is it different?

very slight improvement on the right foot, but there is alot of room between the exhaust and the heat shield. I would think Ducati or someone could come up with a new heat shield for the racing exhaust system and suck it in alot more. It seems to stick out way more than it needs to.

 

[flynbulldog]

Because the holes are there so I assume that they must still be used, but I am new to these bikes. Is this true? Do I have to use them?

Most exhaust system ( all that I have purchased and installed) come with the bungs for o2 sensors but the bungs are plugged. Were there plugs for the sensor bungs?

I don't know if the o2 sensors are required for the full system, I would unplug them and find out...

 

[kel3at]

Most exhaust system ( all that I have purchased and installed) come with the bungs for o2 sensors but the bungs are plugged. Were there plugs for the sensor bungs?

I don't know if the o2 sensors are required for the full system, I would unplug them and find out...

There were no plugs for the bungs supplied, but I will try unplugging the o2 sensors and see if I get an error code.

 

[kel3at]

Most exhaust system ( all that I have purchased and installed) come with the bungs for o2 sensors but the bungs are plugged. Were there plugs for the sensor bungs?

I don't know if the o2 sensors are required for the full system, I would unplug them and find out...

Unplugged the rear sensor and started her up, got a light with P0141 error code - lambda open curcuit or something like that. Plugged the o2 back in and erased the code.

 

[flynbulldog]

That tells me that the DP ECU uses the o2 sensors and that the DP ECU runs closed loop just the same as the standard ECU.

So much for tuning with a power commander

So much for spending the money on a Termi system with a DP ECU to fix our fueling problems...

 

[zach34]

That tells me that the DP ECU uses the o2 sensors and that the DP ECU runs closed loop just the same as the standard ECU.

So much for tuning with a power commander

So much for spending the money on a Termi system with a DP ECU to fix our fueling problems...

Possibly, yes, but not necessarily. If those O2 sensors are like what you find on 99.9% of modern vehicles, they are heated and the ECU will perform a test to make sure there are no open circuits on start-up, but that does not mean that they are used. Fuel injection systems that I am familiar with require about 30 seconds or more of warm-up time until they switch over to closed loop. Not only do the O2 sensors have to heat up, but the engine coolant temperature has to reach a certain range to better atomize the fuel before closed loop can be effective.

It's possible that the DP ECU inherited the system checks from the stock ECU, but ignores them and remains in open loop during operation.

Assuming that this is the case with the Ducati fuel injection system, and if closed loop operation is really the culprit, then you should notice a slight difference in the way the bike runs during the first 30 seconds to a minute after a cold start-up (cold as in 'been-sitting-all-night' cold). If you notice the bike running smoother during this period, then you could disconnect the O2 sensors and plug the bungs in the exhaust. You would have to live with the check-engine light, or find a way to suppress those codes, and you would probably take a slight hit in fuel consumption, but the ECU will most likely just always remain in open loop. Definitely not a solution for the long term, but if the bike is exceedingly difficult to ride as is, then this could be a consideration.

 

[desmoworks]

Possibly, yes, but not necessarily. If those O2 sensors are like what you find on 99.9% of modern vehicles, they are heated and the ECU will perform a test to make sure there are no open circuits on start-up, but that does not mean that they are used. Fuel injection systems that I am familiar with require about 30 seconds or more of warm-up time until they switch over to closed loop. Not only do the O2 sensors have to heat up, but the engine coolant temperature has to reach a certain range to better atomize the fuel before closed loop can be effective.

It's possible that the DP ECU inherited the system checks from the stock ECU, but ignores them and remains in open loop during operation.

Assuming that this is the case with the Ducati fuel injection system, and if closed loop operation is really the culprit, then you should notice a slight difference in the way the bike runs during the first 30 seconds to a minute after a cold start-up (cold as in 'been-sitting-all-night' cold). If you notice the bike running smoother during this period, then you could disconnect the O2 sensors and plug the bungs in the exhaust. You would have to live with the check-engine light, or find a way to suppress those codes, and you would probably take a slight hit in fuel consumption, but the ECU will most likely just always remain in open loop. Definitely not a solution for the long term, but if the bike is exceedingly difficult to ride as is, then this could be a consideration.

DP ECUs that run open loop don't work that way. All functions associated with the O2 sensor are disabled.

I didn't know the SF full system retained both O2 sensors. This is the first full system for a Marelli ECU that I've heard does this. The new Monster 696/1100 DP ECUs are the same, but they are different FI systems.

 

[vampire]

i have a simple question, how louder is the full termi compared to the slip-ons?! `

love the spaghetti

 

[blackie]

I,m now glad i made my own....All this pissing about spending lots & lots of cash for not much happiness..

Are Ducati going backwards ?

 

[wannabefast]

I am no expert on ECUs or fuel injection but I do know that open-loop EFI is less performant than closed-loop EFI as it lacks the post-burn feedback and limiting tuning capability. I would imagine a more performant exhaust system like the Termi would still use the Lambda sensors. Is this wrong then?

 

[flynbulldog]

but I do know that open-loop EFI is less performant than closed-loop EFI as it lacks the post-burn feedback and limiting tuning capability. I would imagine a more performant exhaust system like the Termi would still use the Lambda sensors. Is this wrong then?

Wannabe, While this may be true for autos with more sophisticated ECUs and wide band o2 sensors the Duc ECU does not have self-tuning capability and the narrow band o2 sensor are very limited.
They are only used to adjust AFR (very slowly) for pollution control not for tuning on the fly.

If you've been reading this forum you will know that on the Ducati bikes the ability to tune the ECU is limited by the electronics in the closed loop system.

We'd all like to change to open loop so we can tune our bikes and rid them of the running problems that Ducati believes is acceptable and we do not.

 

[jborders5]

DP ECUs that run open loop don't work that way. All functions associated with the O2 sensor are disabled.

I didn't know the SF full system retained both O2 sensors. This is the first full system for a Marelli ECU that I've heard does this. The new Monster 696/1100 DP ECUs are the same, but they are different FI systems.

Agreed. All DP version Marelli ECUs (until now?) will have a trim adjustment to set the idle CO level. The trim adjustment is accessible via VDST or the Ducati DDS tool. If the Termi Full System does not have a trim adjustment, it retains the narrow band sensors.

 

[wannabefast]

Wannabe, While this may be true for autos with more sophisticated ECUs and wide band o2 sensors the Duc ECU does not have self-tuning capability and the narrow band o2 sensor are very limited.
They are only used to adjust AFR (very slowly) for pollution control not for tuning on the fly.

If you've been reading this forum you will know that on the Ducati bikes the ability to tune the ECU is limited by the electronics in the closed loop system.

We'd all like to change to open loop so we can tune our bikes and rid them of the running problems that Ducati believes is acceptable and we do not.

I see, thanks for the clarification.