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Discussion Starter #1
Still no metal replacement for the plastic quick connects on the 999? The stupid POS is leaking... WTF was Ducati thinking?!?!?
 

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I feel your pain about O rings. Long time back I researched the QD's and was actually able to obtain the "Blueprint' ( that term ain't used much unless your and Old Dog like me) from the manufacture of the QD's. It told me the material & sizes for the upper and lower rings which is well known in this site. I use for the first/top black O ring Mcmaster Carr Viton ETP Number 011 Durometer 75A ring , #2857T117 5pc's for $5.50. ETP top chem. resist Viton, although you can buy the lesser Viton #011 75A durometer practically any Viton is suitable. As for the BLUE O rings they are Fluorosilicone #011 #8333T121 5pc's for $2.12
Next DO NOT scratch the O ring groove whatsoever on the QD's. I make my removal tools usually out of 1/8 or thicker brass in a drill press, about 5" long and I taper w/a file the tip almost to a point 5/8 to 3/4 long taper by eye. REMEMBER while spinning RUN SLOW otherwise 1/8 brass can WHIP it's gonna hurt and cause physical damage!! Once tapered and polished with sand paper to a gloss (the finer the paper the better ) and polish using old time Crocus cloth. Next I drill a hole into a wood block and bend the polished tips to almost 90 deg or whatever. Sometimes they snap if the brass is too hard, if so soften it buy heating to about 1000Deg, dull cherry and quech in water. I've probably made 75 O ring tools like this for work and friends. Or you can buy Plastic dental picks I think through Brownell's or Sinclairs. Us firearm boys need plactic picks. Last thing is USE OIL and put the top black Viton ring on first, then the softer Blue one on last.
After seeing how over time the QD's retainer rings elongate from heat and time I've made up Stainless Steel offset strap mounted on studs off the fuel pump base. The strap is just there as a safety. NOT TOUCHING the head of the QD's so the strap actually sits on a nut on the stud, NOT FORCING the QD's inplace. Using a strap is a nice safety feature I feel.
Yes on one fuel pump inlet/outlet I also realized how sharp the edges were. So I took a felt "bob", polishing compound, on a Dremel and polished the edge where the orings have to pass. NOT FOR THE FAINT OF HEART or the UNSTEADY.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Well, I guess it means no metal alternative? It's not so much the o-ring that craps out, is more the plastic that stops grabbing and the thing just sit loose...
 

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Yes I've seen some metal QD's other Duc owners are using also some other plastic types, I think from "Colder" a industrial disconnect? But HOW/IF they use them connected to fuel pumps is unknown to me. Just be careful ANY connector make sure it is fuel and pressure compatable otherwise it could be flaming Duc!!!!! Search the Forums.
I also think I know what you're talking about being "loose". I've seen the QD's elongating over time/heat, hence the reason I made the Stainless safety retainer in case the grippers fail there is no way in hell the QD is coming off!

I originally used 2 Zip ties on each connector one around the top barb gripper and one right below to keep the upper one from falling down. Gave up with that idea due to fat fingers and fabricated the offest Stainless safety retainer.

I also bought 2 new Duc QD's and keep them as spares (Yes Duc dealers sell them) also with Oetiker crimp clamps#1540039 16.8mm , with radiused edge and insert, exact OEM Duc. Some dealer will provide the OEM clamps but they require some TLC not to over crimp. Most people hate the crimp clamps, but you do need some type of srew clamp/crimp clamp with fuel line. Note in some lesser essential areas Ducati uses 2 type of releaseable stainless clamp. But my gut tell me they may not be able to be reused many times. AND NOT FOR FUEL LINES.
Anybody want the print from the QD manufacterer contact me. OOPS I tech'd out again.
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
I like the idea of the strap: I'll do the same on mine.

I've found this picture



What about using safety wire and to strap it and hold the QD in place? Or even a stainless steel wire tie?

Long term I can see that as soon as the fuel pump flange come off I take it apart and weld a 1/4 NPT bung in place of the female currently molded in the plate so I can install some old school CPC coupling...
 

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If you have the time hold off with any welding. You must be quite the welder to attempt welding to cast aluminum or alloy with the fuel pump on or even removed !!!!!!!
Maybe by tonight I can have some photos posted of the standoffs & strap. Gotta run
 

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Discussion Starter #8
If you have the time hold off with any welding. You must be quite the welder to attempt welding to cast aluminum or alloy with the fuel pump on or even removed !!!!!!!
Maybe by tonight I can have some photos posted of the standoffs & strap. Gotta run
I wouldn't be doing the welding myself: I have a fabricator I've used in the past. At one point I added an oil cooler on a BMW Z3: to do it I had to use a take off plate to relocate the oil filter remotely. Since the clearance were very tight I had to weld the fittings on the takeoff plate. Here's a couple pix of his work:





I admit were both billet alu parts, when when I was discussing with him about adding an air-to-water intercooler which required sandwitching the core in the manifold he said there would have been no problem welding cast and billet.

Anyway, for now I vented my frustration, bought two new plastic QD from Ducati and a bag of o-rings from McMaster-Carr (thanks for all the info, I went with regular Viton). I'm looking for a spare pump to work on.

I did noticed that the 03-04 or 749 pump assembly in place of the QD has two elbows which appear to be held in place by a bolt.

 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Btw, since you know your o-rings: why Viton on the upper and Fluorosylicon on the bottom? Any reason why not to use Viton top and bottom?

Also, I noticed that the Viton o-rings are available also in MIL-spec: anything to it other than bragging rights?
 

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First I'm simply one of those people if I see a product like Viton Duro. 75a then Viton ETP Extra Chem resist. Duro 75A, I simple say WTH I can afford a few dollars more why not. I prefer Mil Spec because the quality has to be certified. Call It bragging rights? But that's not in my character. I TRY to find the best products for any application since I'm doing all the work for myself, at zero dollars per hr. I figure buy the best. But trying to buy the BEST(?) doesn't allways work.
As for Viton which is a Trade name, Hell you can go to Harbor Freight and buy VITON O rings. I have a major axe to grind with Foriegn rubber these days. I keep saying (not to sound racist) that in certain countries they must be recycling old condoms! I've seen Viton, Buna N, Neoprene, etc. used in with the proper lubricants/application and degrade within days to weeks to marshmallow consistancy. I could go on for an hrs. with so many auto/bike rubber parts. They may say what the material is but their life span is short compared to OEM. Hell my 98 Chev pickup is still running on the original CV joint rubber boots and their is NO sign of cracking or splitting! My sons 02 VW GTI OEM CV boots lasted about 8-9 yrs. I told him to buy OEM VW but did not because of cost. The supposed TOP quality Aftermarket CV boots LASTED ONE FREAKIN YEAR and need replacement. Sorry for another rant.
As for Fluorosilicone 011 Blue O rings is an interesting point since FluoroS is not rated as high as viton last I looked against Fuel. I interpert Ducati's choice because they are quite soft and conform to any irregular surface better. But when I first saw Blue O rings I had to find out what the Hell they were. so I followed Duc's lead. Although any VITON should do the trick plus I think Brown Viton is a little softer but not as soft as the Blue stuff. I'm sending a short PM next.
You've shown me some beautiful welding! I have a TIG welder for alum but I suck at Alum.
I like the 749 pump elbows can't wait see if they will fit our pumps"
No to be a JO but many people forget when Aluminum is welded (say 6061 T6) reguardles of the alloy it is dead soft after welding, no longer T temper. To bring welded part back to the original temper the entire piece needs aluminum heat treating to regain the temper. Easy for large mfgr's for auto's, bikes, bicycles etc. But those weld do look beautiful.
 

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I have to second that rant from fatman about the rubber. CV boots, ball joint boots, valve cover gaskets, inner and outer tie rod boots etc. I stick to one brand of A/M for suspension joint but try to buy OEM when possible, and even that does not always work. Really, any rubber(any part for that matter) can look the same in the box, give it time and it will show what is is made of.

If you're trying to keep fuel off a hot engine, I'd stick with a known good supplier.

As for the clips...
I was told to remove the clips with a small screw drive or pick and NOT to remove them the way it looks like they were intended(by squeezing them) because it will fatigue the plastic and they will break. I've stuck to that and have not had an issue. I do keep a spare set in my tool box too.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
You guys are great: thanks for teaching me...

Since we're talking about o-rings you should check out this: Beisan Systems. Raj is a good friend of mine and made a business out of selling replacement o-rings for the VANOS which is the pneumatic system developed by BMW for their variable cam timing. The idiots used Buna-N so you can imagine how much these o-rings last in hot oil. Being arrogant Germans they never acknowledged the problem.

Anyway, the Duc is back together: I've replaced the fittings with new ones, coated them generously with silicon grease. Life is good since it's not pissing fuel on the exhaust anymore, but I still have a bag of o-rings (p/n/ 1201T22) coming in from McCaster-Carr. I'll keep as spares, along with a new connector...

In the meantime I'm cleaning out a box of billet parts to collect some money and buy a pump assembly to modify...
 

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I like some of those fixes on the previous pages. I too hate the QD's on my 999. There are several companies out there that make great all metal QD's, and you guys have great ways of attaching them to the existing plate. Be VERY careful welding to the plate. Cast alum is like an almost burnt cookie. Porous and crumbly.

Also, FYI another CRAPPY part of the fuel area is the wiring that goes through the plate. I recently fixed mine bc the crap wire tends to break inside the epoxy of the plate. Simply drill through and replace with nicer wire. I soldered in a section of wire and the solder joint was then covered in replacement epoxy to prevent fuel leaking through the wire. ;0)
 
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