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Discussion Starter #1
Well, I rode 928 miles this past weekend and now have a bit over 5k miles on my 2015 MTS. I wanted to note down my thoughts on the bike as, I'm not sure how much longer I'll have it.

TL:DR - Ducati made an amazing bike but, a part from a couple of exceptions, the good ideas are poorly executed and the bike, as a whole is flawed.

Starting with the things that are straight good; the handling is excellent (I can drag a knee on this thing, it's epically good!), skyhook evo is excellent, the motor is excellent (that's just excluding the tune *which can be fixed*), pinch adjustable screen.

The good ideas that are poorly executed:
Cruise control: not exactly a new idea but, really glad that Ducati have it on the bike. How is it poorly executed you ask? In markets where people use "Miles", the bump controls actually work in KPH so, when you try bumping your speed up or down, you sometimes hit the button twice for one "MPH" because #MATH. I've also found that, if you're cruising and speed up, while above your cruise speed, if you hit the "down/set" bump button it'll actually set your cruise speed rather than bump down the stored cruise speed. That may be by design but it was unexpected for me.
Cornering headlights: One of the reasons I wanted the 2015 over my 2012 but, poorly executed as they only really point in one direction which, only really works for one corner radius. Otherwise, they're not really helpful. I pretty much use them to flash cars that put me in their blind spot when I don't have any other way out. Lean the bike to 6º at the car and it lights them up.
Backlit switchgear: Great idea, really, really great idea... execution... not so much. You light up that there's a button there but not what the button actually does? So, how is that helpful exactly? The buttons should have their symbols lit up as well so you have some chance of knowing rather than just having to remember them anyway.
Seat height adjustment: Did you seriously include THREE separate pieces of plastic to raise the riders seat that use DIFFERENT bolt sizes than the single piece of plastic you have to use to close the gap on the passenger seat if you're not using the spacer for the rider? O_O Also, for all of us "normal" sized people (I'm 5'9"), the bike was designed around the lower seat height - everything wind related is better at the lower setting (except I have long legs for my height so my knees hurt).
Display: Yes, it's very pretty (and, actually, I really like that uses the ambient light sensor to change between night and day mode, that's a win) but please don't touch it... oh, it's scratched now. Everything is in KPH but is converted for display which is why you can't go 64mph.
Fuel gauge: I can't even tell people how irritating it is to me (YMMV) that Ducati have had problems with the fuel sender unit for the last what, 5 model years (?) and haven't fixed it (I suppose you could argue that they've fixed it many times...). Aside from that, this is a touring bike (with a bunch of sport, obviously) and the fuel light comes on with 2 gallons left... in a 5.3 gallon tank?! Seriously? On my 900+ mile trip this past weekend (mostly freeway) I averaged 50mpg so (52.4 was my best, ~130 miles, put 2.9 gallons in the bike), I should be able to get ~220 miles out of a tank of gas and *still* have some left to not run the fuel pump dry but my gas light comes on at 150/160?
Keyless ignition: So I don't need my key... until I need gas... then I need to fish it out from somewhere because there's nowhere to put it on the bike anymore.
Bluetooth: if you want to use the "player" to control your phone, you can't see range or miles travelled. Who thought that was a good idea? The BT on the bike is flakey at best, I know some people have found it to be ok but I just can't use it. Even with all other profiles deleted, I cant use it as a comms hub between my phone and BT headset, it drops out constantly.
LHS controls: If I have my hand inboard on the clutch, I'll occasionally activate high beams when I'm changing gears, not a huge deal but certainly conceivable.
DWC/DTC: Both have settings that are pointless. 8? Seems like we should have gone to 11 because it's louder.
Headlights: Much improved over the 2012 (not sure about the '13 & '14) but what's the the dark halo in the high beam?
Panniers: I like them but the removing them can sometimes lead to issues, like don't want to keep trying for fear of breaking a tab (again - warranty)

(not actually the bike but, part of a pattern)
The "urban" tank bag: you have the USB hub have a really long, straight plug, thereby taking up a bunch of room inside the bag? Did you think this would be good? You have a rain cover for the bag that doesn't have room for the (possibly?) waterproof connector?
The app (it's a beta so, somewhat expected): Constant issues connecting to my account; I have created two accounts and, the last issue required me to change my password before I could log in... I rode 900 miles this past weekend and couldn't get the app connected even after I'd resolved the account problems. The developers were threatening to release it soon and, if so, I really hope I'm an exception.

Stuff that's actually bad:
Fueling... EURO4 compliance means we have shitty fueling which, at best is irritating and at worst dangerous. On the trip, I actually felt it pretty strongly trying to overtake on the freeway in urban mode (much softer for bumpy roads) as well... :-(
Starter motor never really feels like it's ready to roll. :-/
Issues with seat losing cover... (not the first time this has happened on a Ducati model...)
Pannier tab broke
Bolt fell out of center stand (possibly my responsibility)
Center stand damaging exhaust shield
Front brakes got soft in < 3k miles (need to be bled) and are now getting soft again - I need to put RBF600 in them because the DOT4 or whatever they're using doesn't cut it.

Ducati's lack of communication on the actual issues on this bike is really disappointing. This is my 5th Ducati and, I like it better than my 2012 MTS in spite of all of this; it's an excellent motorcycle but it'll be my last Ducati for a while. I'm happy to discuss solutions to these issues because I haven't decided if I'm going to switch or not but, one of the big reasons I'm considering it is the way Ducati is handling these problems. Hopefully new management will start doing a better job of looking after customers but who knows?
 

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i agree with much of what you said, a couple of the items actually made me laugh. the best of the bunch are the back-lit buttons on the controls and the method in which the seat is raised or lowered, that one really gets me. they (Ducati) must think that once the seat is set, it's set, and one would find no reason to switch back, but i'm one that would like the ability to do so without it turning into a mini garage project. some of the other items (keyless ignition but key needed for fuel, brakes that need to be bled, fuel gauges that don't work) are carryovers from previous model bikes and i've become almost numb to them. as i said years ago, we're all to blame for buying these bikes as much of their misgivings are known before entering the dealership. the problem for me is that i still don't care to RIDE any of the other bikes in the segment, they just plain bore me or are too big.

the 2nd gear/3500rpm problem has to be fixed, and soon.
 

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Hey man, that's too bad. I feel for someone who isn't enjoying their brand new bike to the max!

Disclaimer; FYI the 1st gen multi's had their problems too (surging, buffeting...) but the engine negated all those problems. Well, almost.

That's why we had high hopes for the marriage of Ducati and Audi. A little common sense and German engineering couldn't be all bad right? Still waiting.....
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Somewhere, your new KTM 1290 Super adventure waits in a showroom.
That's probably one of the last bikes on my list. KTM make great bikes but they just don't float my goat.
@oalvarez - As far as carry over issues, the DVT has more than is reasonable IMO. That's part of why I'm considering options, it smacks of hubris that there should be so many of them on the 2015. I would disagree with the no place to put the key on the 2012 (at least) since there was the cubby on the right hand side. I could get a card, my license and the key in there and then not have to take any bag when I'm riding my one piece (safest suit I have). Execution problems on new features aren't reason to ditch the bike, IMO but, in combination with all the carry over issues make the bike extremely irritating for me.

Certainly agree with the bikes in the market, hoping there's an option coming soon.
 

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I love my '12 (46,000 miles+) and havent had any major issues and was hoping this 'new' motor would really be the 'cats meow', but geeez Ducati.....how can you release the bike with this many issues, especially the motor?!!? The 1290 SMT seems great, but holy shit Sherlock, the bike is uglier then the 1190/1290 and I didnt think that was possible. Does KTM design their bikes as ugly as possible on purpose? Problem is, nothing on the market hits the 'spot' like my MTS. Would a R1, in MTS garb, hit the spot?
 

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Well, I rode 928 miles this past weekend and now have a bit over 5k miles on my 2015 MTS. I wanted to note down my thoughts on the bike as, I'm not sure how much longer I'll have it.
Hey Dan, your review makes me happy I'm keeping my 2013. I'm definitely on a wait and see before I make a move to a DVT.

About options: I agree, the KTM 1290 is not it. The BMW S1000XR is the perfect machine, but it just isn't inspiring. The MV Agusta Turismo Veloce is one of the most fun motorcycles I've ridden lately. But it is no Multistrada... I would love the Turismo Veloce as an addition... not a substitution, as we discussed before.



What else is there from Europe? Then there are a few Japanese bikes...
 

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That's probably one of the last bikes on my list. KTM make great bikes but they just don't float my goat.

@oalvarez - ?...I would disagree with the no place to put the key on the 2012 (at least) since there was the cubby on the right hand side.....
For sure, I was referring to the fact that you still need a key for the fuel tank but can start the bike remotely. I'd rather have a keyed ignition but that's really not the argument here.

Our opinions are the same. A great riding bike but which comes with the typical Ducati oversights of the last five plus years.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
IWould a R1, in MTS garb, hit the spot?
I doubt many manufacturers would be able to combine the functionality and "soul" (for want of a better word) that Ducati does. I like the crossplane crank sound but there's more to the bike than that. Ducati is doing their best, it seems, to be the Ferrari of the motorcycle world (amusingly, considering the what the "F" in F4 stands for...) by working as hard as possible at making an electronic motorcycle in pursuit of speed and functionality. Realistically though, Honda's the only manufacturer who hasn't got on the 21st century bandwagon at this stage.

The MV Agusta Turismo Veloce is one of the most fun motorcycles I've ridden lately.
I'm hoping to get to ride one this week (if it actually comes in) in Lusso form as that definitely checks all my boxes. I'm hoping it'll be a bit inspiring like I generally find Ducatis to be. When I "upgraded" to the 2015, I was actually thinking I'd like a smaller capacity, lighter version (there's talk Ducati will be releasing a 959 MTS for 2016) so I'm hoping the MV will hit that balance. I also do a lot of sport riding and, only own one bike. I've ridden the Brutale 800 and loved the motor, I have a thing for triples, so I genuinely hope the MV TVL lives up to the hype. Based on your excellent review (thanks! *cough*shamelessplug*cough*: Riding the 2016 MV Agusta Turismo Veloce 800 | I'd rather be riding?) it sounds like the Lusso version may. MV has already hinted at the 1000cc version.

For sure, I was referring to the fact that you still need a key for the fuel tank but can start the bike remotely.
Oh, I misunderstood. Personally, I like the keyless ignition and, if I didn't have the tank bag, I'd probably leave the key in the gas cap but it doesn't stay in half closed position like our old keys did either. I'm sure it's cheaper to make but it's just a step backwards, IMO. I feel like they could have ditched the silly switch under the screen to turn the bike one and had a bloody key holder there given that we have a button on the RHS switchgear. Damn, that should have been in my thoughts above, I suppose. ;-)
 

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If you like triples, consider the Triumph Tiger Explorer? Sort of a Mad Max look. And no chain maintenance.
 

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There's a good chance I'm going from my '13 1200S to a '16 Hyperstrada. I rode a '14 Hyperstrada that was traded in a couple weeks ago and was really surprised how much I liked it. It's known that the motor is getting bumped up to 937cc next year on the Hypers and I enjoyed the 821, it's very smooth and pulled hard in that light bike. I bought an '07 S2R 1000 Monster this summer and have been riding the heck out of it, love it. The simplicity and lightness of that bike is very appealing. In a similar vein, that's what I liked about the Hyperstrada. A seating position akin to a Multistrada and much lighter and simpler. I don't need all the bells and whistles the new DVT comes with and the inherent price paid for them. I'd anticipate there'll be further updates on the '16 Hypers too, having been fairly unchanged for the last three years.
 

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I doubt many manufacturers would be able to combine the functionality and "soul" (for want of a better word) that Ducati does. I like the crossplane crank sound but there's more to the bike than that. Ducati is doing their best, it seems, to be the Ferrari of the motorcycle world (amusingly, considering the what the "F" in F4 stands for...) by working as hard as possible at making an electronic motorcycle in pursuit of speed and functionality. Realistically though, Honda's the only manufacturer who hasn't got on the 21st century bandwagon at this stage.


I'm hoping to get to ride one this week (if it actually comes in) in Lusso form as that definitely checks all my boxes. I'm hoping it'll be a bit inspiring like I generally find Ducatis to be. When I "upgraded" to the 2015, I was actually thinking I'd like a smaller capacity, lighter version (there's talk Ducati will be releasing a 959 MTS for 2016) so I'm hoping the MV will hit that balance. I also do a lot of sport riding and, only own one bike. I've ridden the Brutale 800 and loved the motor, I have a thing for triples, so I genuinely hope the MV TVL lives up to the hype. Based on your excellent review (thanks! *cough*shamelessplug*cough*: Riding the 2016 MV Agusta Turismo Veloce 800 | I'd rather be riding?) it sounds like the Lusso version may. MV has already hinted at the 1000cc version.


Oh, I misunderstood. Personally, I like the keyless ignition and, if I didn't have the tank bag, I'd probably leave the key in the gas cap but it doesn't stay in half closed position like our old keys did either. I'm sure it's cheaper to make but it's just a step backwards, IMO. I feel like they could have ditched the silly switch under the screen to turn the bike one and had a bloody key holder there given that we have a button on the RHS switchgear. Damn, that should have been in my thoughts above, I suppose. ;-)
I'm glad you will get a chance to ride an MV Agusta TV Lusso, I will be interested in reading your thoughts on the bike. And I assume if rumors are surfacing for a 1000cc version it is likely an inline 4.
 

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There's a good chance I'm going from my '13 1200S to a '16 Hyperstrada. I rode a '14 Hyperstrada that was traded in a couple weeks ago and was really surprised how much I liked it. It's known that the motor is getting bumped up to 937cc next year on the Hypers and I enjoyed the 821, it's very smooth and pulled hard in that light bike. I bought an '07 S2R 1000 Monster this summer and have been riding the heck out of it, love it. The simplicity and lightness of that bike is very appealing. In a similar vein, that's what I liked about the Hyperstrada. A seating position akin to a Multistrada and much lighter and simpler. I don't need all the bells and whistles the new DVT comes with and the inherent price paid for them. I'd anticipate there'll be further updates on the '16 Hypers too, having been fairly unchanged for the last three years.
That's interesting. See how things are a question of opinion... I really liked the Hyperstrada, just thought it was a bit bare for touring, a dashboard that is so low you can't look at it while riding and does not have much information (I like data). Other than that, it is a fun motorcycle. The Turismo Veloce felt like the Hyperstrada while riding, it is light, it feels light, it accelerates with ease, it turns in quick. And then it has touring features, a better dashboard, bags that seem to work, it looks great (while the Hyperstrada never grew out of its motard beginning - it's time to move on).

Now if Ducati will build a Hyperstrada with a bigger motor, I would, my opinion here, hope they would grow out of the motard style and produce something different, color TFT dash, etc.

Now, I like the Hypermotard SP. But then, it has no pretensions of becoming a touring (strada) motorcycle.
 

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I test rode a '15 a couple weeks ago, demo at my semi-local but good to me dealer.

The seat cover was coming apart on the demo, which was the first thing I noticed. On the ride, I loved the brakes, engine smoothness and intake noise. I thought the switches were an improvement over my '12, minus the heated grip switch, with gloves on I couldn't hit the button with my right hand. Maybe the handguard adjustment?

I was able to replicate the 2nd gear issue on the first try, major safety issue. Sure you can ride around it but you may be In that spot and need the power right then.

Pegs felt higher than my '12 but seat may have been in low position.

Suspension was fantastic, sporty in the sense it's "ready to go and begs to be pushed harder".

My '12 steers quicker but I've got forged wheels and some other light parts, as well as pulled the forks up 5mm.

All in all I liked the bike but it felt slower than my '12, which by all accounts it should, and with the glitches it's not ready enough for me to trade up.

I didn't notice the "hole" in the power band but my normal 6th gear torture test was impossible with the traffic that day.
 

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That's interesting. See how things are a question of opinion... I really liked the Hyperstrada, just thought it was a bit bare for touring, a dashboard that is so low you can't look at it while riding and does not have much information (I like data). Other than that, it is a fun motorcycle. The Turismo Veloce felt like the Hyperstrada while riding, it is light, it feels light, it accelerates with ease, it turns in quick. And then it has touring features, a better dashboard, bags that seem to work, it looks great (while the Hyperstrada never grew out of its motard beginning - it's time to move on).

Now if Ducati will build a Hyperstrada with a bigger motor, I would, my opinion here, hope they would grow out of the motard style and produce something different, color TFT dash, etc.

Now, I like the Hypermotard SP. But then, it has no pretensions of becoming a touring (strada) motorcycle.
I hear you Lion, it's all a matter of perspective and priorities. I looked at a Tursimo Veloce on vacation in SoCal this summer, great looking bike and a blast I'm sure. Living in the midwest there just isn't enough dealer support to own a MV and actually ride it.

There is an over $7k difference in the price of the DVT and a Hyperstrada. I can afford a new DVT, but many of the extra features you get for that $7k difference don't mean anything to me. It's a trade off, the DVT would for sure be a better touring bike, the Hyperstrada more fun for anything else, to me anyway. I've had two 1200 Multistradas and two a/c Multis as well. It just seems time for something different, though I love Ducatis and have a great dealer. It's always a compromise when you buy a new bike, whether because of price, design, features, or even the dealer and support.
 

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Some cheese to go with that whine?

Well, I rode 928 miles this past weekend and now have a bit over 5k miles on my 2015 MTS. I wanted to note down my thoughts on the bike as, I'm not sure how much longer I'll have it.

TL:DR - Ducati made an amazing bike but, a part from a couple of exceptions, the good ideas are poorly executed and the bike, as a whole is flawed.

Starting with the things that are straight good; the handling is excellent (I can drag a knee on this thing, it's epically good!), skyhook evo is excellent, the motor is excellent (that's just excluding the tune *which can be fixed*), pinch adjustable screen.

The good ideas that are poorly executed:
Cruise control: not exactly a new idea but, really glad that Ducati have it on the bike. How is it poorly executed you ask? In markets where people use "Miles", the bump controls actually work in KPH so, when you try bumping your speed up or down, you sometimes hit the button twice for one "MPH" because #MATH. I've also found that, if you're cruising and speed up, while above your cruise speed, if you hit the "down/set" bump button it'll actually set your cruise speed rather than bump down the stored cruise speed. That may be by design but it was unexpected for me.
Cornering headlights: One of the reasons I wanted the 2015 over my 2012 but, poorly executed as they only really point in one direction which, only really works for one corner radius. Otherwise, they're not really helpful. I pretty much use them to flash cars that put me in their blind spot when I don't have any other way out. Lean the bike to 6º at the car and it lights them up.
Backlit switchgear: Great idea, really, really great idea... execution... not so much. You light up that there's a button there but not what the button actually does? So, how is that helpful exactly? The buttons should have their symbols lit up as well so you have some chance of knowing rather than just having to remember them anyway.
Seat height adjustment: Did you seriously include THREE separate pieces of plastic to raise the riders seat that use DIFFERENT bolt sizes than the single piece of plastic you have to use to close the gap on the passenger seat if you're not using the spacer for the rider? O_O Also, for all of us "normal" sized people (I'm 5'9"), the bike was designed around the lower seat height - everything wind related is better at the lower setting (except I have long legs for my height so my knees hurt).
Display: Yes, it's very pretty (and, actually, I really like that uses the ambient light sensor to change between night and day mode, that's a win) but please don't touch it... oh, it's scratched now. Everything is in KPH but is converted for display which is why you can't go 64mph.
Fuel gauge: I can't even tell people how irritating it is to me (YMMV) that Ducati have had problems with the fuel sender unit for the last what, 5 model years (?) and haven't fixed it (I suppose you could argue that they've fixed it many times...). Aside from that, this is a touring bike (with a bunch of sport, obviously) and the fuel light comes on with 2 gallons left... in a 5.3 gallon tank?! Seriously? On my 900+ mile trip this past weekend (mostly freeway) I averaged 50mpg so (52.4 was my best, ~130 miles, put 2.9 gallons in the bike), I should be able to get ~220 miles out of a tank of gas and *still* have some left to not run the fuel pump dry but my gas light comes on at 150/160?
Keyless ignition: So I don't need my key... until I need gas... then I need to fish it out from somewhere because there's nowhere to put it on the bike anymore.
Bluetooth: if you want to use the "player" to control your phone, you can't see range or miles travelled. Who thought that was a good idea? The BT on the bike is flakey at best, I know some people have found it to be ok but I just can't use it. Even with all other profiles deleted, I cant use it as a comms hub between my phone and BT headset, it drops out constantly.
LHS controls: If I have my hand inboard on the clutch, I'll occasionally activate high beams when I'm changing gears, not a huge deal but certainly conceivable.
DWC/DTC: Both have settings that are pointless. 8? Seems like we should have gone to 11 because it's louder.
Headlights: Much improved over the 2012 (not sure about the '13 & '14) but what's the the dark halo in the high beam?
Panniers: I like them but the removing them can sometimes lead to issues, like don't want to keep trying for fear of breaking a tab (again - warranty)

(not actually the bike but, part of a pattern)
The "urban" tank bag: you have the USB hub have a really long, straight plug, thereby taking up a bunch of room inside the bag? Did you think this would be good? You have a rain cover for the bag that doesn't have room for the (possibly?) waterproof connector?
The app (it's a beta so, somewhat expected): Constant issues connecting to my account; I have created two accounts and, the last issue required me to change my password before I could log in... I rode 900 miles this past weekend and couldn't get the app connected even after I'd resolved the account problems. The developers were threatening to release it soon and, if so, I really hope I'm an exception.

Stuff that's actually bad:
Fueling... EURO4 compliance means we have shitty fueling which, at best is irritating and at worst dangerous. On the trip, I actually felt it pretty strongly trying to overtake on the freeway in urban mode (much softer for bumpy roads) as well... :-(
Starter motor never really feels like it's ready to roll. :-/
Issues with seat losing cover... (not the first time this has happened on a Ducati model...)
Pannier tab broke
Bolt fell out of center stand (possibly my responsibility)
Center stand damaging exhaust shield
Front brakes got soft in < 3k miles (need to be bled) and are now getting soft again - I need to put RBF600 in them because the DOT4 or whatever they're using doesn't cut it.

Ducati's lack of communication on the actual issues on this bike is really disappointing. This is my 5th Ducati and, I like it better than my 2012 MTS in spite of all of this; it's an excellent motorcycle but it'll be my last Ducati for a while. I'm happy to discuss solutions to these issues because I haven't decided if I'm going to switch or not but, one of the big reasons I'm considering it is the way Ducati is handling these problems. Hopefully new management will start doing a better job of looking after customers but who knows?
The DVT has undoubtedly been plagued with issues, some of which are carryovers, some not. So far on mine, Ducati has replaced the seat, the dash, a pannier clip, the centerstand spring. I've never even bothered with the Bluetooth system, I just have my big ole phone in a bracket on the bars, and linking in the motorcycle's BT system really doesn't add anything I need.

Starter motor -- no different than older Multis, it seems like it won't start the bike, but I got over it, because it's never failed me. The battery has, but for $100 I picked up one of those little lithium jump-starter batteries, works like a charm if I left the bike too long without disconnecting the main battery.

The 2d gear issue is addressable -- Ducati is preparing to release a corrected map, rexxer is releasing one, and the Termi map will work as well. If you've seen the torque curve that rexxer has posted, I mean holy fuck. THAT's midrange torque.

The brake bleeding issue is a drag, but if you're already getting soft, make them find the pressure leak and replace what's necessary! Or, if you can stand it, put speed bleeders all over, then it's only a few minutes to bleed the front. The rear is an overnight job, but I've got 8000 miles on the bike without a bleed and I can turn off the ABS and lock the rear wheel, definitely an improvement from my 2013. I spent $100 on the Shift-Tech gas cap, no key needed.

For my money, YES this has been painful, but if the new map comes in as promised, my only remaining issue (bruised ego aside) will be not having anything serious left to bitch about. And that's not a good enough reason for me to sell it.
 

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And that's not a good enough reason for me to sell it.
Which is good, because with all the well-deserved bad press on this bike, you'll be hard pressed to find many buyers for it.

I think Evil Steve gave a fair assessment of a bike that was released too soon. I would hardly call that whining. This is all on Ducati.
 

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Which is good, because with all the well-deserved bad press on this bike, you'll be hard pressed to find many buyers for it.

I think Evil Steve gave a fair assessment of a bike that was released too soon. I would hardly call that whining. This is all on Ducati.
All bikes have issues.

Evil Steve's assessment is a good one, especially his third paragraph: Starting with the things that are straight good; the handling is excellent (I can drag a knee on this thing, it's epically good!), skyhook evo is excellent, the motor is excellent (that's just excluding the tune *which can be fixed*), pinch adjustable screen.

Handling, suspension and motor are excellent, three of the most important things about a motorcycle.

It's a Ducati, he won't have any problem selling it.
 
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