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Discussion Starter #1
Yesterday when I was leaving work, I let my bike idle for about 2 minutes or so while I geared up. I rode down the street to a stop light, and the engine felt kind of jumpy but since it usually is a bit jumpy when cold, I didn't make anything of it. I then tried to take off when the light turned green but the bike stalled. I held in the clutch, tried to start it up, and nothing. So I pulled over to the side of road and kept trying to start it, but there literally wasn't any noise when I pressed the start button.

Then I turned on and off the bike 2-3 times, and it finally started up but was idling kind of low…almost right before the point of stalling). Tried giving it some gas while in neutral and the bike revved up, dipped below the idle point, and died. I started the bike again, let it sit there and idle for probably 2 more minutes, and then rode off.

It might have just been in my head, but on the way home it felt like the bike had less power than usual but wasn't stalling at all. When I got home I turned it off and let it sit for about 20 minutes, then got back on and went for a short ride….and the issue was gone. The bike started right up, sounded normal, idled normally, and performed normally.

Any idea what might have happened? I'm worried this was just a taste of a larger issue that might come up later down the line.

Thanks in advance!
 

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I imagine everything was normal on the ride in? How many miles on the bike, any modifications made?
 

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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
I imagine everything was normal on the ride in? How many miles on the bike, any modifications made?
The bike felt like it had a little less power on the ride home after it started up, but I don't know if it was just in my head or not...

There is around 3400 miles on the bike, no mods at all other than the removal of the evap emissions canister. One thing that might be worth noting is that something has been wrong with my catalytic converter for the past month or so -- something broke off inside, which causes it to make a rattling noise when the bike is cold. One of the things I noticed when the bike was running weird yesterday was that the rattle wasn't happening at all. I'm wondering if the broken cat has anything to do with it...

(I've been meaning to get it replaced, but have been thinking of de-catting instead)
 

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Sounds like whatever broke off in the cat had the exhaust plugged or barely moving any air
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Sounds like whatever broke off in the cat had the exhaust plugged or barely moving any air
Hmm that's what I was thinking might have happened as well...guess it's time to look into either getting it replaced or de-catting.

Speaking of decatting, is there any difference between the Termignoni and Leo Vince de-cat kit besides price? I couldn't find any info on the differences other than that the Termignoni might not void an existing warranty (I have one for 6 more months or so and might end up extending it)?
 

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how about just take off the pipe and clean whatever is inside.
 

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The main difference between the Termignoni and the LV cat delete is the price almost twice as much for the Termignoni :eek:

but I would still take it in for a new one at your dealer ,who knows when things will change and a cat will be required for inspection(which would totally suck ).
 

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Yesterday when I was leaving work, I let my bike idle for about 2 minutes or so while I geared up. I rode down the street to a stop light, and the engine felt kind of jumpy but since it usually is a bit jumpy when cold, I didn't make anything of it. I then tried to take off when the light turned green but the bike stalled. I held in the clutch, tried to start it up, and nothing. So I pulled over to the side of road and kept trying to start it, but there literally wasn't any noise when I pressed the start button.

Then I turned on and off the bike 2-3 times, and it finally started up but was idling kind of low…almost right before the point of stalling). Tried giving it some gas while in neutral and the bike revved up, dipped below the idle point, and died. I started the bike again, let it sit there and idle for probably 2 more minutes, and then rode off.

It might have just been in my head, but on the way home it felt like the bike had less power than usual but wasn't stalling at all. When I got home I turned it off and let it sit for about 20 minutes, then got back on and went for a short ride….and the issue was gone. The bike started right up, sounded normal, idled normally, and performed normally.

Any idea what might have happened? I'm worried this was just a taste of a larger issue that might come up later down the line.

Thanks in advance!
Hey I was wondering if you took your bike to the dealer and if that cured it because my bike has started doing the same thing ,and I have no cat the only difference is I have no power loss after it starts this has happened only 3 times over the last 2 months after a warm up . Is it loading up ? 3 different times three different tanks of fuel too .
Runs fine after I get it going by holding the throttle slightly on,after 3 or 4 starting attempts,where it will start and stall right away .
Any ideas from anyone else ?
ride-on
Bob
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Hey I was wondering if you took your bike to the dealer and if that cured it because my bike has started doing the same thing ,and I have no cat the only difference is I have no power loss after it starts this has happened only 3 times over the last 2 months after a warm up . Is it loading up ? 3 different times three different tanks of fuel too .
Runs fine after I get it going by holding the throttle slightly on,after 3 or 4 starting attempts,where it will start and stall right away .
Any ideas from anyone else ?
ride-on
Bob
Just replied to your private message...the issue hasn't happened again since then, but I'm in the process of getting my broken cat replaced, so I'll let you know if it happens again in the future.
 

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Did it sound like the starter was still turning when it was running? When it died do u recall the sound like the starter solenoid disengaging? My starter switch took a shit and i had very similar issues. The starter button wouldnt engage the starter at times and when it did the starter wouldnt disengage and kept running w the motor. This would make it rev sluggish and die because of the low lumpy/jumpy idle(drag of the starter motor).

Sometimes this would happen and sometimes everything was perfectly fine. Im assuming it all depended on what was going on in the starter switch. Sometimes it wouldnt engage the contact to fire the starter and then sometimes it wouldnt disengage fully allowing the starter to disengage. Its all very clear if u take the switch apart..

I tore the starter button apart and was pretty dissappointed how wimpy it is and the low level quality of the design. If the contact points barely get moved around in there it can stay engaged, not start at all, etc, etc. Take urs apart and ull see what i mean. U can verify the two contacts are still locked into position and also that the spring for the button is still seated as its suppose to.

Theres not much margin for error in that switch and w a rattling dry clutch its hard to tell if the starter is still engaged when the motors running. Have u dropped ur bike or knocked that side of the handle bar into something? Thats what caused my issue. I eventually got a new starter switch off ebay. I noticed it also didnt go together quite well with the taper of the protaper bars im running. This allowed the starter switch body to not bolt together entirely toward the thicker section of the bars(toward center) compounding the internal issues on my starter switch.

I know its kinda Far fetched, but who knows? Listen closely when u shut off ur bike, u can hear the starter disengage if it was still running...im surprised my starter wasnt fubared from being revved up to such a great rpm prior to finding my issue. I dunno what the gear ratio is on the starter gear to bull gear, but im sure just a couple thousand rpm on the motor is astronomical in the starter motor.

I might be way out in left field, but if u do hear the starter turn off after u kill the motor(its hard to distinguish) pull that switch apart on the handlebar. Ull see what i mean regarding the two contacts being very close together and not very well held in position, and the little return spring for the starter button(main contact point). I think the starter motor on the earlier bikes(not the seimens fuel injection bikes)keep the starter turning even if u release the button until the motor is actually running?? This made it even trickier for me to pinpoint my switch issue.
 

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Hey thanks for sharing that. Mine is Seimens after it starts and stays running there is no performance loss, but I will pull that switch apart just to check anyway,and give the starter a close ear. The bike starts initially fine I let it warm for a minute or 2 get on it pull the clutch in and it stalls and won't run for 3 or 4 attempts .No CEL either(Id like it better if there were one) . Like I said this is an intermittent problem and has only happened 3 times in 2 months.
Its going to the Ferracci for a map soon (with in 2 months),hopefully its something they have heard of before if I can't figure it out by then.
Thanks again for the explanation of your problem. If you type like me I know that took a bit of your time which is most appreciated!
 

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Yeah, it sucked!!! Im typin on a phone which makes it even funner! Let us know how the bike issues go...hopefully it dissappeared.
 

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I did check the switch (I see what you mean about it ),no problems there.Its so infrequent that I'm sure I can wait till the dyno tune & ECU flash . I'm 90% sure my starter is not running on .
On my phone I use voice to text you should see how that comes out sometimes (not an I phone).
ride-on
Bob
 

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booger welds you are completely correct !
Update: it is the starter not disengaging(I heard it on a stall) ,but the switch looks fine .
Ever since I've owned it, I push the starter button for 1/2 a second and the starter runs(with my finger off of the button) by it self till the bike starts. after seeing the switch up close I guess this is not normal ,since it does it every time I assumed thats how it was designed .I just had the side case off too.I should try a new switch first though what a POS it is . @ booger welds the Ebay switch was generic or a used Duc switch (link?).I guess I could disassemble again and jump it to be sure its not the switch.
My other ? is , is this screwing up anything ? It does disengage after a bit it won't run with it on .
Thanks for the help.
ride-on
Bob
 

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Hey! Thats great u found it. I bought a cheap dirtbike start/stop switch From cyclegear temporarily as i wasnt convinced that was the prob initially. It has ended up working so well its still on the bike. I would recomend going to ebay and shopping for the switch at imperial cycles in denver. Ive been piecing my wrecked bike together through them and the prices are great and the dozen or so items i bought were in great shape(everything from a complete wiring harness to a monster sr4 seat and tank).

For the dirtbike switch i just cut the two wires off at the solder point on stock starter switch(keeping the run/no run portion functional). I guess it helps as a theft deterent as the dealer couldnt figure out how to fire up my bike when i had the ecu tuned:)
 

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I can text u pics if u need anything. Just PM me a cell number or an email address. Theres not much to it though...

I was really confused at first because apparently my bike(08) keep the starter engaged until the bike is actually running even if ur not pushing the button anymore.

I kept the factory button setup all there and probably wont change anything for theft deterent reasons, like i said...if u have a cyclegear nearby, they have 2 or 3 different start/stop style switches to choose from. Makes it easy to rig
 

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Ferracci says there is a relay going bad(looking at the schematic now) ,and the starter runs on one touch of the button,and disengage at start up.
So with your modded switch you hold it in till it starts old school.
That could work around the malfunctioning relay then.
Its going to the dealer anyway(fresh out of warranty).
I made my Dyno appointment for the 6th next month with a properly degreed race cam install ( I could do the mechanics but not the degreeing)and a ECU flash(no flapper more rpm) If the OL only knew .... :D
 

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YEah, my bike went in for the dyno tune/ecu reprogram and holy shit did it transform the bike. So smooth and torquey now. I ditched the flapper, cat and put K&N pods on it. The two bros can i used is straight thru too. Sounds good, almost too loud, but the neighbors have harleys so im good:)
 
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