hi ducvet. not done any multis but a heap of 1198 supers. most like the stock flywheel. my early experiments started with a machined aly wheel. full aly wheel. machined steel and full steel. most people, me included, liked the stocker. on the few multis ive ridden it didnt feel to me like i would like to lighten the wheel. my belief is the more toque the engine produces, the less it likes a light wheel. the wet really brings out the shortcomings of the lighter flywheel. my thoughts and experience only.
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Lighter flywheel in 1200
Hey just getting an idea how many of you 1200 owners have tried a light flywheel on your 1200?
I just rebuilt a 1200 (bad main) and while I was in there I saw how heavy the stock flywheel is on the 1200 (almost 9lbs). I did some modifications and fitted a early model 4 lb flywheel instead of fitting a 2lb flywheel I normally would use.
Just curious what other 1200 owners have done with their flywheels?
I just rebuilt a 1200 (bad main) and while I was in there I saw how heavy the stock flywheel is on the 1200 (almost 9lbs). I did some modifications and fitted a early model 4 lb flywheel instead of fitting a 2lb flywheel I normally would use.
Just curious what other 1200 owners have done with their flywheels?
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Xracer
I often take bikes down to 2lb flywheel as it is a good compromise of keeping idle and not increasing engine braking too much. Some like more some less. On the 1200 the flywheel is starting life at almost 9 pounds so the heaviest I have found yet. the change was great enough we only dropped it to 4 pounds which is still more than a 1198 (IIRC they are just over 2 pounds) so should be plenty fine. Taking moore than 1/2 the weight though always gives you pause hence my question for others who have done so on a 1200 multi.
If it were my bike I would spend enough time to know but all I do is test ride them and it feels okay to me but long term real world use?
Makes me wonder if the added mass as well as more weight out on the crank end is not some of the problem with multi crank and bearing failures. The oem flywheel is about 10mm thicker so some of that weight is on the end nearer the alternator cover bearing.
I often take bikes down to 2lb flywheel as it is a good compromise of keeping idle and not increasing engine braking too much. Some like more some less. On the 1200 the flywheel is starting life at almost 9 pounds so the heaviest I have found yet. the change was great enough we only dropped it to 4 pounds which is still more than a 1198 (IIRC they are just over 2 pounds) so should be plenty fine. Taking moore than 1/2 the weight though always gives you pause hence my question for others who have done so on a 1200 multi.
If it were my bike I would spend enough time to know but all I do is test ride them and it feels okay to me but long term real world use?
Makes me wonder if the added mass as well as more weight out on the crank end is not some of the problem with multi crank and bearing failures. The oem flywheel is about 10mm thicker so some of that weight is on the end nearer the alternator cover bearing.
My reply was for the large supers, I like to pull a fair bit off the smaller bikes but as the capacity and torque goes up I keep the weight on.
On the note that you think the heavy flywheel maybe the causes of a lot of crank fails. In the late 80’s a lot of people ran the big GSXR’s as race bikes when the rules allowed. Crank failures were common but not on the little bikes (750’s) Suzuki believed it to be the harmonics produced by the crank because of rubber front engine mounts being replaced with solid aluminium mounts in race trim. Failures were common and not random. Maybe, just maybe, there are some harmonics in the multi engine that over time cause bearing issues. And the possible cause could be the heavy flywheel. Food for thought.
On the note that you think the heavy flywheel maybe the causes of a lot of crank fails. In the late 80’s a lot of people ran the big GSXR’s as race bikes when the rules allowed. Crank failures were common but not on the little bikes (750’s) Suzuki believed it to be the harmonics produced by the crank because of rubber front engine mounts being replaced with solid aluminium mounts in race trim. Failures were common and not random. Maybe, just maybe, there are some harmonics in the multi engine that over time cause bearing issues. And the possible cause could be the heavy flywheel. Food for thought.
I wouldn't invest the time or money did one on my 999s didn't change much other then a little touchy starting!
i also think the impact of one depends on the rest of the bike, as an overall inertial ratio for want of a better term. if you have a light bike and light wheels, etc, as well as the greater capacity then it's of less need and often not as nice as on a heavy bike (both static and rotational). like it's good on a 996 or 999 coz they're quite fat, but not an 1198 which is lighter on both counts and, realistically, has engine internals that weigh the same or less.
mts 1200 really aren't that heavy either, given what they are, and have similar wheels, etc.
like when the pro racer gets dragged along to the new model launch and says how "nice and smooth" the stocker is, which in his reality really translates as heavy and slow.
mts 1200 really aren't that heavy either, given what they are, and have similar wheels, etc.
like when the pro racer gets dragged along to the new model launch and says how "nice and smooth" the stocker is, which in his reality really translates as heavy and slow.
my f3 is "nice and smooth" bradi also think the impact of one depends on the rest of the bike, as an overall inertial ratio for want of a better term. if you have a light bike and light wheels, etc, as well as the greater capacity then it's of less need and often not as nice as on a heavy bike (both static and rotational). like it's good on a 996 or 999 coz they're quite fat, but not an 1198 which is lighter on both counts and, realistically, has engine internals that weigh the same or less.
mts 1200 really aren't that heavy either, given what they are, and have similar wheels, etc.
like when the pro racer gets dragged along to the new model launch and says how "nice and smooth" the stocker is, which in his reality really translates as heavy and slow.
does it have the counter rotating crank?
oh, yes. they are mucho slo.
I did it on my old hypermotard 1100 with awesome results. Reved much faster
Yes I do like about a 2lb flywheel as they usually keep good driveability (masks most issues) the question is more a matter of do 1200 multistrada owners want or care about faster acceleration when the bike already has more performance than 90% of riders need or want. Yet when the V4 mutistrada comes out I am sure there will be plenty of buyers who will salivate at the chance to own some thing more powerful than their current slug of a 1200...lol
I did test ride the bike today and it feels pretty normal to a superbike rider, the customer had me put a 14 tooth front sprocket on as well so it is a pretty comfortable rocket ship. I hope that's what he wants when he gets it, anyway. I felt as you would expect it was most happy 3000 rpms and up but it may be the case if you are looking at light flywheels you probably do not drive at super low rpm's anyway. From my short 10 mile ride I would certainly consider it fine for the way I ride a bike, still depends as always on application.
I did test ride the bike today and it feels pretty normal to a superbike rider, the customer had me put a 14 tooth front sprocket on as well so it is a pretty comfortable rocket ship. I hope that's what he wants when he gets it, anyway. I felt as you would expect it was most happy 3000 rpms and up but it may be the case if you are looking at light flywheels you probably do not drive at super low rpm's anyway. From my short 10 mile ride I would certainly consider it fine for the way I ride a bike, still depends as always on application.
Here is a follow up on this last post.Yes I do like about a 2lb flywheel as they usually keep good driveability (masks most issues) the question is more a matter of do 1200 multistrada owners want or care about faster acceleration when the bike already has more performance than 90% of riders need or want. Yet when the V4 mutistrada comes out I am sure there will be plenty of buyers who will salivate at the chance to own some thing more powerful than their current slug of a 1200...lol
I did test ride the bike today and it feels pretty normal to a superbike rider, the customer had me put a 14 tooth front sprocket on as well so it is a pretty comfortable rocket ship. I hope that's what he wants when he gets it, anyway. I felt as you would expect it was most happy 3000 rpms and up but it may be the case if you are looking at light flywheels you probably do not drive at super low rpm's anyway. From my short 10 mile ride I would certainly consider it fine for the way I ride a bike, still depends as always on application.
I did almost 500 miles by now with this setup, I love it! The bike should have been with lighter flywheel from the start, it's manageable in low RPM as well, though I am usually never below 3k rpm anyways. Also between the 14 tooth in the front and the flywheel mod, the bike is a beast, a Multi on steroids, it's truly accelerating like a rocket ship, front wheel feels very light for some reason ;-)
I own a Diavel with the testa 11 engine, it's been a good thing, i love it actually....
There have been some issues with cranks breaking and without wanting to start debate on why, the Gen2 has a lighter flywheel and a heavier crank than the Gen1 apparently, so to save myself any anguish down the line i replaced my std flywheel, about 4kg! with a std 1098 flywheel which is a shade over 2kg.
It accelerates faster and is much nicer to ride almost everywhere, i do notice on the motorway i sometimes have to change down to 5th rather than chug on in 6th when overtaking but it's no big deal.
Others may not have this issue because i am running the std 15/43 final drive and i have also replaced the monstrously heavy wet clutch/primary assembly with an EVR alloy dry slipper and 1098 primary gear set, which saved more than the flywheel change did in terms of weight.
So overall my rotating mass of crankshaft assembly is easily 4kg lighter than standard, i could go up a couple of teeth on the rear sprocket to gear it down a little, hopefully avoiding the lugging vibration that comes with too low rpm now but i'll wait until the chain is due before i do that.
There have been some issues with cranks breaking and without wanting to start debate on why, the Gen2 has a lighter flywheel and a heavier crank than the Gen1 apparently, so to save myself any anguish down the line i replaced my std flywheel, about 4kg! with a std 1098 flywheel which is a shade over 2kg.
It accelerates faster and is much nicer to ride almost everywhere, i do notice on the motorway i sometimes have to change down to 5th rather than chug on in 6th when overtaking but it's no big deal.
Others may not have this issue because i am running the std 15/43 final drive and i have also replaced the monstrously heavy wet clutch/primary assembly with an EVR alloy dry slipper and 1098 primary gear set, which saved more than the flywheel change did in terms of weight.
So overall my rotating mass of crankshaft assembly is easily 4kg lighter than standard, i could go up a couple of teeth on the rear sprocket to gear it down a little, hopefully avoiding the lugging vibration that comes with too low rpm now but i'll wait until the chain is due before i do that.
If you replace the front to 14, or ad 2 to 3 on the rear, you will find the 6th gear more usable.I own a Diavel with the testa 11 engine, it's been a good thing, i love it actually....
There have been some issues with cranks breaking and without wanting to start debate on why, the Gen2 has a lighter flywheel and a heavier crank than the Gen1 apparently, so to save myself any anguish down the line i replaced my std flywheel, about 4kg! with a std 1098 flywheel which is a shade over 2kg.
It accelerates faster and is much nicer to ride almost everywhere, i do notice on the motorway i sometimes have to change down to 5th rather than chug on in 6th when overtaking but it's no big deal.
Others may not have this issue because i am running the std 15/43 final drive and i have also replaced the monstrously heavy wet clutch/primary assembly with an EVR alloy dry slipper and 1098 primary gear set, which saved more than the flywheel change did in terms of weight.
So overall my rotating mass of crankshaft assembly is easily 4kg lighter than standard, i could go up a couple of teeth on the rear sprocket to gear it down a little, hopefully avoiding the lugging vibration that comes with too low rpm now but i'll wait until the chain is due before i do that.
Shedding off 2kg or a little over 4 pounds from the flywheel is absolutely noticeable, the bike accelerate faster and stronger engine braking, only in your case it's even more so.
Is the clutch allot more noisy now? I also wonder if you feel difference on operating it? smoothness and so on...
If you replace the front to 14, or ad 2 to 3 on the rear, you will find the 6th gear more usable.
Shedding off 2kg or a little over 4 pounds from the flywheel is absolutely noticeable, the bike accelerate faster and stronger engine braking, only in your case it's even more so.
Is the clutch allot more noisy now? I also wonder if you feel difference on operating it? smoothness and so on...
The 14t swap is common but i'm not a fan, i'd rather go up on the rear, i don't like the smaller radius of the 14 with such a long chain, i know lots of people say it's fine but i find it's a fine line getting the chain tension just right so it's not too tight nor does it slap on the lower guide.
The Dry clutch makes more noise than a wet clutch, sure, but it's the 48t type so it doesn't clutter like a worn out 12t style, i like the dry clutch noise, i also like the open cover and cool look but i also like the EVR slipper, it's much more usable than the slipper that comes std in the wet clutch.
The operation feels just as smooth as before, but i will say getting the pushrod length right was a bit tricky, once that was sorted it's been fine.
Another quick update, It's now more then 2000 miles and even some off road riding, I think this is how the Multi should have been setup from the start, the bike is a rocketship and tons of fun, it is manageable even in lower 2,000 - 2,500RPM, but it is happier above 3,000 rpm.Yes I do like about a 2lb flywheel as they usually keep good driveability (masks most issues) the question is more a matter of do 1200 multistrada owners want or care about faster acceleration when the bike already has more performance than 90% of riders need or want. Yet when the V4 mutistrada comes out I am sure there will be plenty of buyers who will salivate at the chance to own some thing more powerful than their current slug of a 1200...lol
I did test ride the bike today and it feels pretty normal to a superbike rider, the customer had me put a 14 tooth front sprocket on as well so it is a pretty comfortable rocket ship. I hope that's what he wants when he gets it, anyway. I felt as you would expect it was most happy 3000 rpms and up but it may be the case if you are looking at light flywheels you probably do not drive at super low rpm's anyway. From my short 10 mile ride I would certainly consider it fine for the way I ride a bike, still depends as always on application.
If my Dr. at the VA tells me I am heavy and slow at my next appointment, I'll just tell him that I am nice and smooth....like when the pro racer gets dragged along to the new model launch and says how "nice and smooth" the stocker is, which in his reality really translates as heavy and slow.
:laugh:
:grin2:
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
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