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Integrated TURN SIGNALS in MIRRORS

18K views 111 replies 22 participants last post by  ITACUD750 
#1 ·
Hey all....

I have a 2000 SS.

I bought these mirrors with integrated lights by Ducati:
http://www.ducati.com/shop/product.jsp?catid=cat1020121&prodid=prod840118

...and have found that the BULBS in these are NOT THAT BRIGHT and to top it off when the mirrors are positioned correctly..for my viewing pleasure...most of the REFLECTOR LIGHT faces the ground.

Has anyone substituted these, what I believe to be 194 wedged bulbs for LEDs? The bulbs are 1-1/2" long x 3/4" wide #12V10W.

Any suggestions?
 
#44 ·
Yes, down and rearwards. It's not possible just to move them down, because then it's not possible to run the lines from the reservoir to the master cylinders. I've ordered on of the CycleCat top triples from OnCycle and they come with tapped holes for the reservoirs, so I will move them when I get the triple installed - if I can find an even better location that is ;)
 
#45 ·
my cycle cat triple just came yesterday. its pretty sweet. the blemish is underneath, towards the front. when installed, you would never see it.

anyway. is that what the holes are for on the triple towards the front of the triple on the bottom side? i havent installed it yet, or really looked at it. because as it sits now, my stock containers are mounted off the master cylinders.

it would be sweet to reroute them to those holes underneath
 
#46 ·
is that what the holes are for on the triple towards the front of the triple on the bottom side?
Yep, that's what the holes are fore. Here is a pic I found on the net, notice the location of the reservoirs...
 

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#54 ·
Here is another picture, I guess that makes mine the horisontal ones?

I don't think that the cups will be in the way when installed like on the gold-bike. I will check it out, when I get my triple clamp (it will be send together with the new fuel tank)...
 

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#63 ·
I just installed my rear CA a week ago on my 07 SS and they still blink stock speed without the resistors. It seems to be somewhat random whether or not they change your blink speed....

Possibly it is linked by differences in model year?

On another thread that I started at least 2 people with 05+ SS said that theirs went to blinking faster without the resistors, but was not the case for me.

Now I will have to see if it makes a difference when I put on my Front LED mirrors....
 
#65 ·
Here is the circuit diagram I promised of the LED inserts I made. It's really not that complicated: 6 LED's in series, and a 100 ohm resistor to set the current at 20mA as specified for the LED's. This is providing a 14,5V battery voltage with the engine running (as on my bike).

The 10 ohm, 25W power resistor should only be installed, if the LED's are flashing too fast. On my bike I have the resistors at the rear end (ClearAlternatives integrator board), but the flash rate did not go up, when I installed the LED's in the mirrors, so I did not install resistors at the front.

Hope this helps..? :)
 

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#66 ·
HELP??? LED with wedge installed on mirrors - DONT BLINK

I bought some LEDs with a wire and different adaptors. I used the WEDGE, as the original bulb was a 194 wedge. (see pic)

But, for some reason they DO NOT blink! They both stay a steady low bright.
Did anyone have to do any modifications on yours to make the LEDs work?

I do have rear CLEAR ALTERNATIVE INTEGRATED taillights, which are LEDs for brake and turn signals, so I don't know if that's causing a problem? help?????


/Users/loginuser/Desktop/LED.jpg

 
#67 ·
I bought some LEDs with a wire and different adaptors. I used the WEDGE, as the original bulb was a 194 wedge. (see pic)

But, for some reason they DO NOT blink! They both stay a steady low bright.
Did anyone have to do any modifications on yours to make the LEDs work?

I do have rear CLEAR ALTERNATIVE INTEGRATED taillights, which are LEDs for brake and turn signals, so I don't know if that's causing a problem? help?????


/Users/loginuser/Desktop/LED.jpg

You can't just install a LED as if it was a bulb..! Your link to the picture does not work, so I can't see, what you have done, but from you description it sounds like you have just replaced the bulb with a LED. That's a NO GO... Consider yourself lucky if you have not fried anything...

LED's are polarized, so you must have the correct ''leg'' towards 12V. You must also use the correct value of the resistors to limit the voltage and current to the spec of the LED. See my schematic above.

If you upload the schematic we have a chance to comment on your installation...
 
#68 ·
Morten, I have several questions for you regarding your LED inserts for DP mirrors. I've already installed a clear alternative integrated taillight along with a pair of mini bi-directional LED indicators by Oberon and everything is working great. I am now determined to make a pair of the inserts you've posted above. Would it be possible to use more LED's in each mirror? CA uses over 30 for each indicator and Oberon uses 16. Could I use 2 rows of 5 or 6 if they fit? also would these be the correct LED's (i'm looking at the amber23)? Is this the correct 100 ohm resistor? [URL="http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062315&cp=&sr=1&origkw=100+ohm+resistors&kw=100+ohm+resistors&parentPage=search"]http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062315&cp=&sr=1&origkw=100+ohm+resistors&kw=100+ohm+resistors&parentPage=search
Thanks for your help, Mike. (maybe it would easier if you just started selling these yourself! ha ha)
 
#70 ·
Yes, you can use as many LED's you can fit in there. You simply connect the rows in parallel. Here is a drawing indicating 3 rows with 6 LED's in each. Remember the current limiting resistors.

Yes, your 100 ohm resistors are fine.

You will need some kind of small circuit board to fit them on also. In the attached pics you can see some, that fit's in the original socket.

Regarding the LED's you link to: They are not as bright as the ones I use, but they are much cheaper, so you can just use more, and get a good intensity. LED's are a trade of between intensity and view angle. From the ones you have linked to I would use the amber ones named ''LED5 23 Amber''. They have good intensity (8300 mcd) and a nice view angle (23 deg).

I use amber LED's because my indicators have clear glass. If yours have orange glass you can use clear LED's. Look for a type with high intensity and good view angle...
 

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#71 ·
Just Had to...

Hi guys! Sorry to interrupt such a nice thread!! Even though I currently own only a carby 91' 900ss. I was reading about this thread and man, I had to say to MB4duc, THANKS!!!! Thanks for all your time, information, pics and a genuine interest in helping us duc owners!!! It certainly speaks for yourself!!! Thanks MB4duc!!!


Vickon
___________
91' 900ss
92' 907ie
06' HD Custom
and soon an 05 SS1000DS!
 
#72 ·
Hi guys! Sorry to interrupt such a nice thread!! Even though I currently own only a carby 91' 900ss. I was reading about this thread and man, I had to say to MB4duc, THANKS!!!! Thanks for all your time, information, pics and a genuine interest in helping us duc owners!!! It certainly speaks for yourself!!! Thanks MB4duc!!!


Vickon
___________
91' 900ss
92' 907ie
06' HD Custom
and soon an 05 SS1000DS!
Thanks for your interruption ;) And it's not ''only'' a 91 carby SS. It's a 91 carby SS :D
 
#73 ·
#75 · (Edited)
I have designed each row, so there is no need for a voltage regulator ;) Or basically; the 100 ohm resistor is the voltage/current regulator for the row.

I can't find the datasheet for the LED's I have. Their type is mentioned on my circuit diagram above, maybe you can google them. I bought them in the local electronic store here in Denmark. If you decide to come here to shop your LED's then let me know: Beers will be on me :D

EDIT... Found the data: Mine are 11140 mcd, but the have much smaller view angle, so basically the ones you have found are a much better choice.
 
#77 ·
#80 ·
Halogen alternative

In my quest to have my 900SS different, I came across halogen indicators on eBay, which i have had on the rear of my bike for over a year.

These babies are 21W halogen and are very bright and cr*p all over the stock indicators for light and appearance. The stock/standard bulbs are normal bulbs with locating pins opposite each other at 180 degrees, which has a code of BA9S mounting. These halogens have pins at 60 degrees, so will not fit unless you put in a new mounting base or snip/grind one pin off the bulb. The code for the pin arrangement is BAY9S, whilst stock is BA9S as above. The Y is in there because of the pin angle being like the upper arms of the letter Y. Google BAY9S and you will find them.

For those wanting small (almost useless, but look good integrated mirrors) check out Haldane motorcycles in New Zealand, which another subscriber put me on to. The mirrors look great, but the indicators are very dull. I had other LEDs that I modified to suit, but would have installed BAY9S if I did not already have LEDs and the knowledge.

Indicator jokes - how sad - too many whiskies ...

Don't blink - it has already gone. Don't flash - you will end up in jail.
 
#84 ·
LEDs "not working" process of elimination

Do your original indicators work? If not then the problem is in the wiring to the indicators, not the LEDs.

Do the LEDs work at all, ignoring whether they flash or not?

LEDs require the wiring polarity to be correct. You may have this the wrong way around. I expect there is a diode on the LED circuit board which will stop current flowing thru the LEDS (and stuffing them) if the polarity is incorrect.
Not being patronising, but red is positive and black is negative, if they were wired correctly at manufacture. Looking at the image you posted, I expect the diode will be a tiny rectangular black "thing" on the back of the circuit board. If they have followed convention, the positive wire will run to this first on the circuit board. Check that this is the red wire.

Can you post an image of the back of the circuit board so I can work out what the circuit is.

Have you tried connecting them directly to a 12V battery to see if they work (they won't flash as this function is in the bikes electronics) If they do not come continuously then either the polarity is wrong or they are stuffed. Check both.
 
#85 ·
Hi - yes the LEDs work. When I have one LED and one regular bulb (one in each turn signal side) the LED works fine. When I put both LEDs they have a constant dim light, just very dull light. I've checked the back of the board, haven't taken a pic yet. But unfortunately the back is a flat cover and both the black and red wires go into a tiny hole with glue untop of them. HELP???? :)

Do your original indicators work? If not then the problem is in the wiring to the indicators, not the LEDs.

Do the LEDs work at all, ignoring whether they flash or not?

LEDs require the wiring polarity to be correct. You may have this the wrong way around. I expect there is a diode on the LED circuit board which will stop current flowing thru the LEDS (and stuffing them) if the polarity is incorrect.
Not being patronising, but red is positive and black is negative, if they were wired correctly at manufacture. Looking at the image you posted, I expect the diode will be a tiny rectangular black "thing" on the back of the circuit board. If they have followed convention, the positive wire will run to this first on the circuit board. Check that this is the red wire.

Can you post an image of the back of the circuit board so I can work out what the circuit is.

Have you tried connecting them directly to a 12V battery to see if they work (they won't flash as this function is in the bikes electronics) If they do not come continuously then either the polarity is wrong or they are stuffed. Check both.
 
#88 ·
LEDs don't blink

LEDs pull very little current when on. Most turn signal flasher units are designed for high current, as the current discharges a capacitor (and the lights work) then switch off after the capacitor is discharged. If the lamp was 8 watts, then the current is 8W/12V = 0.66A LEDs can pull tiny current in comparison, so the capacitor takes a long ttime to discharge and due to the electronics may not discharge enough to "trigger" the off condition.

Simplest way to deal with this is to put a resistor across the positive and negative leads to the LED unit (red and black in your case) to increase the load on the flasher unit so there is decent current draw to make the flasher work. You can buy these in your local "hobby" electronics shop like Dick Smith Electronics, Tandy.

The resistance you need is caclulated by 144/W where W is the rating of the bulb that was in the original bulb indicator. E.g. if it was an 8W bulb, then 144/8 = 18 Ohms. There are standard values for resistors, so choose the nearest standard value to that calculated. If you choose slightly higher resistance, then the LEDs will flash a bit slower. If you choose a lower resistance, the the LEDs will flash slightly faster.

Resistors also have a tolerance - 10% or 5% should be fine.

The final thing is the Wattage rating of the resistor - worts case choose the same Wattage as the bulb was. You could halve this as the indicator is roughly on and off equal time, so the actual Wattage through the resistor is half the bulb rating.

A few final points.
You will need a resistor for each LED indicator.
Resistors are not polarised, so you can connect them either way round.
The resistor can be placed anywhere in the "feed" to the indicator (I.e. it does not have to be at the indicator) so you could connect it across the positive and negative cables at a connector to keep it out of sight.
 
#89 ·
Hi PUNCH, Thanks for your reply. I'm been so busy and now that it's cold I have to put the bike away, but wanted to resolve this LED issue. So as you can see I have 12 LEDs on each board, so I would need 24 resistors? :O Because you mentioned " You will need a resistor for each LED indicator" or do you mean each board of 12 LEDs?
 
#90 ·
Resistor values etc.

You need one resistor only for each assembly of 12 LEDs. The OEM indicators are 10W bulbs. Go to Tandy or similar and buy one 15 Ohm 5 Watt resistor for each complete LED assembly.

Solder the resistor onto the back of the circuit board between the red and black cables. It does not matter which way round the resistor goes as they are the same resistance either way round.

If you do not have a soldering iron, get a terminal strip like the attached image from Tandy or similar big enough to take the existing wires on the LED cicuit board. With a utility cut it so there are two terminals for each indicator/turn signal. Snip the red and black cables and wire the black and red cables back together in the two way terminal. When doing this put the resistor across the terminals between red and black. I have done a small jpg to show this.

When wiring the indicators to the bike connectors, red is positive and black is negative.

Richard
 

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#112 ·
You need one resistor only for each assembly of 12 LEDs. The OEM indicators are 10W bulbs. Go to Tandy or similar and buy one 15 Ohm 5 Watt resistor for each complete LED assembly.

Solder the resistor onto the back of the circuit board between the red and black cables. It does not matter which way round the resistor goes as they are the same resistance either way round.

If you do not have a soldering iron, get a terminal strip like the attached image from Tandy or similar big enough to take the existing wires on the LED cicuit board. With a utility cut it so there are two terminals for each indicator/turn signal. Snip the red and black cables and wire the black and red cables back together in the two way terminal. When doing this put the resistor across the terminals between red and black. I have done a small jpg to show this.

When wiring the indicators to the bike connectors, red is positive and black is negative.

Richard
--------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sooooo sorry I took so long to get back on here to reveal my results.

RICHARD - YOU ARE THE MAN!!!!!!!!!! :) Your above post worked like magic!!!

I bought 2: 15 Ohm 5 Watt resistors one for each of the LED boards I have (LED pic).

I used your diagram (LED and resistor pic) and my dad soldered it into place just like in your diagram.

THEY WORK PERFECTLY!!!!! And the Integrated rear-tail that I had on there already, does not have a resistor. But they all work FINE!!!!!!! I'm really happy that they work because I really was stressing over this for months.

THANKS AGAIN RICHARD!!!! :)
 

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#93 ·
I have a similar but different problem with this setup so I'll post the question here for those that have been following.

I also purchased the DP integrated mirrors/turn signals. At the same time, I bought the smaller DP arrowhead shaped rear turn signals. I installed all four items and tested it out. Regular stock bulbs, not LEDs.

It seems to blink at the regular speed for 3 or 4 seconds, then it speeds up and stays fast. This is a little perplexing to me since if it was resistance based, it would be either constantly fast or slow so I'm not sure why it starts off fine and then changes. IIRC, this never happened with my stock square blinkers and bulbs.

The length of the wires is pretty much the same as on the square blinkers. Nothing else on the bike has changed, except being dropped (the reason for the replacements). When the bike dropped, it shorted the instrument panel and a new fuse fixed all that... but no other changes at all.

Any ideas?
 
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