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Installing motowheels slipper clutch...HELP!

9742 Views 30 Replies 8 Participants Last post by  JDuc
We're currently installing our MotoWheels slipper clutches:

Linky

We took one of them appart from how it came from Motowheels, started installing and left the other one intact so we could tell the order of everything when putting the first one back together.

Well...we're confused.

You put the basket in, and put all those bolts in, then you put the hub in, then put the plates in, then there's this spider spring. It has 6 legs. It goes in, then there's this washer that fits down in the hole that goes around the push rod. Then there's the nut that holds all that together...

Then what?

The way it all came from Motowheels, the next thing is this steel curved washer then this thicker standoff....but how are you supposed to keep the washer in place? It drops down and hangs off of the pushrod and there's no way to hold it in place, same with the thicker standoff washer.

I put a bit of grease on the steel washer and placed it against the nut to hold it in place, then put everything together, put the 6 springs in and tightened everything down.

When I pull the clutch, it doesn't pull even, the pressure plate doesn't pull in evenly and I'm sure that's not right!

Anyone have any ideas?

Anyone?
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
like I said, no one is there today that knows....
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
it's a slipper clutch, the pressure plate doesn't have any teeth in it.

The studs don't have markers on them either since the pressure plate doesn't have to line up a certain way.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
This is how things are installed now:



Here's the back side of the pressure plate:



And here's the steel washer thing:



And here's the thicker standoff washer I mentioned:



I've taken the last two images out of the stack and things seem to work fine. With them it it slipped like mad (20 mph, romp on it, hit 6k, going 23mph now). Now it doesn't, but it also doesn't seem like it does the job of a slipper clutch either

Does this seem right?

We also have 7 friction plates installed and 9 steel plates.

That left us with a friction and a steel plate left over from the kit. They wouldn't all fit in there. What we have in there now is the same numbers as stock....does that make sense?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I've found this link:

http://www.mad-ducati.com/Technical/BucciSlipperClutch/BucciSlipper.html

On page 2, it shows that when you remove the stock basket, you will have the group 'F' come with it. However, on both of our bikes, we didn't have all of group F. We only had the first nut on the left and the 'F' piece that is shown below the plates on that same page.

If you look at page 1 (exploded view of the aftermarket clutch), it shows parts 16, 17, and 18 going in BEHIND the basket. These LOOK to be the parts that we can't figure out where to place. However, they show part 18 to be substantially smaller than what we have that came in the kits.

I have taken out the clutch plates and the clutch hub and just have the basket bolted in. The input shaft looks like the following:


To us, it looks like the spacer is actually mounted from behind the bearing (with a possible lip holding it in place from behind the bearing?). It looks like it would require pulling that bearing out to remove that spacer. Is that where this piece goes?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
blade625CT said:
Jan, the item in the second pic is the hub/drum spacer. It must go in first. you install the o-ring into the recess, and slide it over the input shaft w/ the o-ring end seating against the bearing [inside the primary gear seal]
The second pic? The second pic is the pressure plate??

Or are you saying the last pic?

If so, when we place the 'flange' (the part that holds the bearings and has the studs on it) on the input shaft, and then place that spacer ontop of it, we have no threads sticking out to put the nut on.

look at the inner dia. of the dished washers. one will be the same dia. as the hub/drum spacer, it goes on next. the large dished washer [with the same inner dia. as the hub nut] goes before the spider washer.
We only have one dished washer it looks like this:

??????

if you have it assembled without the hub/drum spacer, you are damaging the back of the hub/drum, as you are torquing it directly against the basket bolts.
As it is right now, it's not backing against the 8 basket bolts because the spacer seen in this pic is spacing it out.


I have looked at the back of the hub/drum and there are no marks what so ever on the back side of it from the 8 basket bolts. The only mark is from that spacer in the above pic.


you should need all the plates, and you MUST start with a friction. If you start w/ a steel, the first time the slipper engages, it will drop behind the hub and screw everything.
so then the plate order is COMPLETELY different from stock? The plate order in the desmotimes book is only good for stock (non-slipper) clutches? Can you tell me how the plates should go in then? Because if I do friction first it's as follows:

1) friction
steel
2) friction
steel
3) friction
steel
4) friction
steel
5) friction
steel
6) friction
steel
7) friction
steel
8) friction
steel
steel
steel

thanks!
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I'm looking at this image:



And realizing that the MotoWheels slipper clutch kit looks IDENTICAL to the STM kit. There's two differences. We only got one 10 and didn't even get a 9.

if you look at this image:




It appears as if 8 and 10 go in place of the spacer that I took a picture of here:



But to do that, I'd have to pull the bearing that surrounds that washer out...that doens't seem right!?

grrrr.....:crazy:
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Instructions?

How do you have instructions?

I was told my the guy on the phone when I called them that instructions didn't even exist!

The only fax we have access to it up at the office.

Does your fax scan as well?
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
thisnjducquacks said:
why would you install something of this magnitude if you have no idea what your doing?
why would you respond to this post if you have nothing of value to add?

fwiw: we're a coupe who have installed two superchargers on our truck over the years, not having any instructions either.

And, we've installed a world class, world finals winning carPC and sound quality system in my car....that didn't come with instructions either...

;)

Do you have a manual that tells you how to whine?
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
blade625CT said:
the stock hub spacer [black collar that is currently still on the shaft in your last pic] must be removed. If you grasp it with a pair of channel lock pliers it will pull off. The only thing holding it on is pressure from the oil seal.
you will see a green o-ring in a recessed groove on the inside, remove it carefully, grease it, and re-install it onto the input shaft, all the way in against the bearing. Then slide on the new hub spacer, #8 in your pic. flange side out [the o=ring seats into the recess in the small end, slightly different than the stock spacer.] Then the dished washer #10, then the drum assembly. Make sure all the ball bearings are seated in the ramps when you install the drum

yes, the plate stack is totally different than stock.

you must start with a friction [see your STM drawing]

this yoyo clutch is identical except for the hub nut [which is a one piece deal that effectively is #11 & 12 together]
this may help a little:
http://www.yoyodyneti.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=T10901
thank you very much!

I will go out and see if I can pull out that piece!

I'll let ya know shortly!
 

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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
no mechanical know how?

how about a degree in mechanical and manufacturing engineering technologies from one of the top engineering schools in the nation?

how about working for race teams myself? (not just mearly working for a mechanic, probably just handed the guy the tools he asked for....heh)

The simple fact of the matter is that installing the slipper clutch without removing the spacer and replacing it with the two pieces in question, did no damage whatsoever. It also didn't make a difference when we installed the two pieces that were in question. This was the only area where we were truely stumped.

Having mechanical know how includes knowing when to ask questions. Having mechanical know how includes being willing to try things on your own, and not forking over hundreds of dollars to someone else on something as simple as a clutch install simply because you don't want to do it or don't have the nuts enough to even attempt it.

I'd appreciate your not coming in here and trying to exert some superiority over someone you know absolutely nothing about, because quite honnestly, it shows your age.


On another note, thanks to everyone who actually came in here with some insight. Especially blade625CT. Your last post was the one that we needed.

Even without pulling that piece, when we installed everything the first time and left the two pieces in question out, it still did it's job just fine. We pulled that spacer and installed the two pieces and everything works just fine, the same as if we hadn't of removed that spacer infact.

I do have a concern about placing a friction plate against the metal ring that's around the slipper portion. Those flat topped screws that are recessed into the ring are NOT 100% flat. We're concerned that putting a friction plate against that will eat up the friction material in a heart beat. We just want to check on that.

BTW: I've hosted pics of the process here:
http://www.mj-garage.com/cpg/thumbnails.php?album=1

If anyone sees anything stated wrong please let me know.
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
I really appreciate your post 2DucJ. I wonder why MotoWheels doesn't send out that exploded view with these kits? It's something I would consider manditory when shipping a product like this. It sure would save on the Advil on their end from having to answer a bunch of questions, etc.

:)
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
it's all taken care of now.

:)
 
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