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We are intending to visit Sweden to view Brown Bears (North of Gavle) alongwith a couple days in Stockholm and need to know what is likely average speed , ignoring motorways , we are likely to manage and any other issues we should be aware of.

I am thinking 250 miles per day is sufficient to allow a relaxed pace with late starts/early finish days (3 hours morning 9-12 and another 3 hrs in the afternoon 2-5 pm)

Can anyone guide us on this please ?
 

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Not sure what you want to know, my friend. But here is some basic info about the legalsystem:
If you exceede legal speed by 30 km/h, and get caught, the cops take away your license. If you watch out for civil cops in their Saabs and Volvos with a lot of antennas on their roofs you shouldn't get into trouble. (There actually isn't a lot of them)

Where are you planning to start your journey?
My adwise, if you have the time, is to just follow these type of blue signs,:

in the direction you are going, and enjoy our beautiful countryside and awesome roads.

Welcome! :)
 

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Life is too short to worry !
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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for the response and apologies for the slow reply.

We are having to wait for a reply from the lodge regarding booking in 2013 (end June) but want to start the process of looking for accomodation , things to/must do and routes but helps to have some local knowledge whilst doing so.

We intend to come over to Sweden from Copenhagen (Ferry at Helsingborg seems the most logical ?) then take two days to get to the lodge north of Gavle skirting Lake Vattern in the process. After the lodge we will head to Stockholm for a couple of days of culture and then down to Oland Island for a rest at the seaside.

We then intend to head home via the Esbjeg ferry covering the 400'ish miles on the same same day with an early start and good cruising speed , possible/realistic ?

Any thoughts/suggestions/insight welcome , we are already getting excited by your lovely country...
 

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We are intending to visit Sweden to view Brown Bears (North of Gavle) alongwith a couple days in Stockholm and need to know what is likely average speed , ignoring motorways , we are likely to manage and any other issues we should be aware of.

I am thinking 250 miles per day is sufficient to allow a relaxed pace with late starts/early finish days (3 hours morning 9-12 and another 3 hrs in the afternoon 2-5 pm)

Can anyone guide us on this please ?
Shoot me a PM, I can give guide you around Stockholm!
I live in Stockholm, but i grew up in Gävle.

So here goes:
Average speed: Traffic normally flows at the speedlimit or 10-15kph faster then posted speeds. Cops usually use either lasertraps by the side of the road or mobile unmarked cars to conduct speedlimit enforcement. Speedtraps are NOT common, but keep your eyes far ahead scanning for speedtraps and unmarked cars (usually Volvo, saab or VW) with several antennas and extra backing up lights. They arent really that unmarked..
Speedlimits are normally 70 or 90kph on non motorways and 90 or 110 (even 120= kph on motorways. Most people drive 10-20 kph faster. Over 30kph faster and they nab your licens and fees are rougly £150 GBP to £450GBP for speeding.

Keeping away from motorways are abit tricky in sweden, becasue we usually post signs for only the closest town that the road goes to, so making a roadbook is like a list of townnames. My advice is get a GPS and set it to avoid motorways. Any tomtom or garmin will do.

If you want to use your cellphone for navigating, check for COMVIQ, TELE2 or TELIA signs at gasstations. They can sell you a prepaid GSM card with datatraffic included.


Thanks for the response and apologies for the slow reply.

We are having to wait for a reply from the lodge regarding booking in 2013 (end June) but want to start the process of looking for accomodation , things to/must do and routes but helps to have some local knowledge whilst doing so.

We intend to come over to Sweden from Copenhagen (Ferry at Helsingborg seems the most logical ?) then take two days to get to the lodge north of Gavle skirting Lake Vattern in the process. After the lodge we will head to Stockholm for a couple of days of culture and then down to Oland Island for a rest at the seaside.

We then intend to head home via the Esbjeg ferry covering the 400'ish miles on the same same day with an early start and good cruising speed , possible/realistic ?

Any thoughts/suggestions/insight welcome , we are already getting excited by your lovely country...
From Stockholm up to Gävle there is a very nice scenic road you can take with hardly ANY traffic instead of plowing the motorways.

Stockholm and just north is renowned for great biking roads. I can give you detailed descriptions if you like.

Above Gävle options become less vaible then the motorway.

Gotland is GREAT! Dont forget to visit the Gotland racetrack which is open to the public on thursday afternoons. Just follow road 149 north from Visby (great ride!) until you see the signs after the cementfactories
Race circuit & race track for motor events & corporate events | Gotland Ring


Shoot me a PM for more info and ill send over my cellphone number!
I can probably arrange secure parking overnight in Stockholm if you need it, not that theft is that common.
 

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Life is too short to worry !
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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks Anders - Still waiting for the bear lodge to decide if we can book so that we can clarify our exact travel dates and schedule.

Very interesting information and helpful when planning , I'll PM you once things are a little clearer (hopefully by the end of Septemeber)

BTW , we are intending to call in on Oland not Gotland but thanks for the tips anyway.

Cheers
Allan
 

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Alright!
Öland is also a good MC riding island.. The Swedish Ducati club has an annual event named Ölands TT there (Road rally, not racing) so I can give some good tips on biking roads if you like.

From Öland north up to Stockholm is a bit of a grey area and i would like a timeframe before offering advice on a route. Ill get in touch with local members to get a good route together. From Stockholm up to Gävle i have excellent local knowledge, so that is no problem. You can choose between motorways, A-roads and B-roads.

Hope you can stop by in Stockholm and say hi!
 

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Life is too short to worry !
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Discussion Starter #7
Hi Anders - Bit pushed for time at the moment but Bear Lodge has confirmed our booking so will PM soon with a more precise schedule and some more questions.
Will certainly want to meet-up and buy you a beer in appreciation when we are in Stockholm.
Cheers
 

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I can certainly give tips on good roads from Stockholm all the way up to bear lodge. I have my favorites from Stockholm to Gävle all the way up to Hagsta, where you vear off towards Ockelbo -> Amot (Åmot) -> Svartbo - Stora Öjungen.

Not many options for going north from Öland to Stockholm until you get to Nyköping.
If you hit route 219 from Nyköping, you have a longer way around, but alot more fun

Let me know when you get to Sweden! My phonenumber is +46 70 425 33 95 or you can email me at [email protected]
I know Ducatisti all across Sweden, so let me know if you need some help and I can probably get onto people with local knowledge.

There are not a ton of dealers if anything should go wrong.. None between Kalmar and Stockholm.. But there are two here in Stockholm and one in Gävle if you need support. There is also one in Bromölla, along the E22 in the south between Denmark and Öland.

Hope it helps!
 

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Hey Mate!
I looked over you PM´d Itinarary again and have some suggestions.

MAIN roads: From the South of Sweden to Askersund -> Follow the [E4] up to Motala and then get onto Route [50]
Alternative "Scenic" route: Follow the [E6/E20] north and get off at Halmstad onto Route [26] up to Jönköping.
At Jönköping, Follow the WEST side of Lake Vattern using Route [195] to Karlsborg (Home of one of Sweden largets forts).
Then route [49] up to Askersund


Askersund to Bear:
MAIN roads: Follow Route [50] all the way up to Toftbyn.
Continue along Toftbyvägen and local roads towards Åmot.
Hang a left [303] towards ALFTA and wait until your reach BEAR.

Bear to Stockholm
MAIN: Follow [303] towards Åmot and continue towards Ockelbo and get on the E4 south. It will take you to Stockholm
Alternate: Follow [303] towards OCKELBO, but DONT get on the E4 south.
Instead pass the E4 and take a right at the T intersection towards Björke/trödje [Hamrångevägen]. The road will take you to Gävle.
Ride through Gävle, Just follow the same road (Kungsgatan) and it will take you straight through.

The Road turns into Route [76] when you exit Gävle towards NORRTÄLJE.
Follow that Road to ÄLVKARLEBY. Take time to STOP at Älvkarleby FALLS (Fallen) and have a coffe at Älvkarleby Hotell and konferens. I used to work there. Great fish dishes! Take Route[291] towards the E4.

If you decide to take the E4 down from Gävle to save time, then below is applicable of you get off at exit 194 MEHEDEBY. in that case take the exit, then RIGHT -> 200m -> Left.

At Mehedeby take a quick Left, then right (if using route [291]). DONT get on the E4, but follow the small road that runs to the west of it. This is [the old E4) if you need directions. A road that is good, but very lightly travelled all the way to Uppsala.
There are two major crossings. The first you go straight through, but must stop. The second you turn RIGHT Towards Månkarbo and UPPSALA.
At Uppsala, Head through the center of town (historic to say the least) or get onto the E4.
 

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At Uppsala

MAIN ROADS: Follow E4 to Stocholm
Alternate: Take EXIT 187
Take route [282] towards UPPSALA.
STRAIGHT THROUGH the roundabout onto ROUTE [255]
Follow [255] towards Sigtuna and MÄRSTA
At Märsta Follow route [263] to NORRSUNDAVÄGEN
SIGNS:ARLANDA STAD GOLF, ROSERSBERG, Upplands väsby
Follow Norrsundavägen to Upplands Väsby and it will take you by the Öhlins factory, just after the first light you get to in Upplandsväsby.
After passing the Öhlins factory, head towards the E4 and use it to Stockholm.

Stockholm - Kalmar
MAIN Roads: Follow [E4] South to NORRKÖPING. Get onto the [E22] down to Kalmar
Alternate: Follow [E4] to Linköping, thn take Route [35] that links up to the [E22] in Gammelby.

From Kalmar on, its a toss up really.. The E22 will get you to Malmö, but there are tons of options.

Ducati Dealships/Services on the way are not very many..
South of Sweden
Tel. +46 46 705167 - Bröderna Hörberg BIL och MC. Löddeköping (Helsingborg)

Alingsas
Biscaya Motor racing (Good people)
+46322630124 city of HOL (wrong side for you unless you go WEST of lake Vättern)

Italia Bike Center (to the east of Örebro]
+4658913830 ARBOGA - GREAT people! Best in Sweden IMHO. tomtom at Hypertrick works there if you want your bike mapped.


Then Its
AVA MC and K3 desmocenter in Stockholm
AVA MC - Vårby allé 53 143 30 (municipality) Vårby +46 8-556 369 00
K3 Desmocenter +46 8-745 08 07 Vendelsövägen 55 136 44 (municipality)Handen

If you use the E22 south, you go through Bromölla which has the last dealership
Claessons motor - Industrigatan 11, Bromölla +46 456-230 30

In an emergency, Call 112 on your cellphone.

If you can, get a fully updated map for Sweden.
Gas is usually either Pay with card, OR gas up first and then go inside to pay.
You want BLYFRI 95 which is like regular. Always use a green nozzle. The black is diesel and blue is ethanol E85. Gas is around 15kr/liter (£1.20 or so)

Policetraps are NOT common, but stay under +30km/h or they take you license. If your using A and B roads, your not likely to see a cop anywhere. Radar and laser warners are illegal and subject to seizure.

Your bike will be safe except maybe in Stockholm. Check with the hotel about garageparking nighttime. Else, check with me. My brother has a safe garage near the national Police building in Stockholm.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks Anders , I will be building your suggestions into our routes and will get in touch again to try arrange a meet , maybe the MC Museum on Saturday 29th ?...
 

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Sounds good!
MC Collecrion is a must see. Outsiders generally get shocked when they go in. An inhouse britten is one of the goodies.

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Wow Anders!
That's some great tips on riding/driving through Sweden!

I'll have to make a note of this.

As we [Finns] live on an "island", the only way for us to Europe is either by boat to Germany (boring and expensive) Ride through the Baltic states (nice, but time consuming) or ride through Sweden on the E4 (boring.. but quite fast.)

and always it is the beginning or the end of the journey for us, you want to get it done as fast as possible, so usually no sightseeing in Sweden, though we know there's lot's to see..
 

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Wow Anders!
That's some great tips on riding/driving through Sweden!

I'll have to make a note of this.

As we [Finns] live on an "island", the only way for us to Europe is either by boat to Germany (boring and expensive) Ride through the Baltic states (nice, but time consuming) or ride through Sweden on the E4 (boring.. but quite fast.)

and always it is the beginning or the end of the journey for us, you want to get it done as fast as possible, so usually no sightseeing in Sweden, though we know there's lot's to see..
We have a similar frustration here in Scotland.
When we moved here in '97 there was a ferry service direct from Aberdeen to Norway but now we have to go into England and get an overnight ferry to Amsterdam/Ijmuiden/Zeebrugge (in our case Newcastle-Ijmuiden) and then travel north to get to Sweden which would otherwise be a one day ride across the Norge/Swede mountain border :(

Hence the stop-over in Copenhagen for a couple of nights.
I think we will take the motorway option as we will be in control of our destiny otherwise we will be at the mercy of ferry times/availablity and weather (my wife does not like boats much)
 

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ok, here's one thought.

On the same trip last year with the van, we used a ferry directly from Sweden(Gothenburg) to England(Immingham)

We were on our way to the Isle of Man for the Pre-TT Classics.

So, you could maybe toss the idea to the wife, about using a direct ferry? Or have you booked everything already?

The ferry is run by DFDS and it IS a freighter, so no amenities... once you are in, thats it. Everyone gets a cabin and there is a lounge.. food is included in the price (3x a day).

The trip takes about 27 hrs.. if I remember correctly, we left Sweden in the evening and arrived in England late next evening. And the price isn't exactly cheap, but it saves you from a lot of riding.

check out About DFDS - Northern Europe's leading transportation provider - DFDSSeaways.com/Freight

If you need more info on this, just ask here or PM.
 

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Life is too short to worry !
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Discussion Starter #16
ok, here's one thought.

On the same trip last year with the van, we used a ferry directly from Sweden(Gothenburg) to England(Immingham)

We were on our way to the Isle of Man for the Pre-TT Classics.

So, you could maybe toss the idea to the wife, about using a direct ferry? Or have you booked everything already?

The ferry is run by DFDS and it IS a freighter, so no amenities... once you are in, thats it. Everyone gets a cabin and there is a lounge.. food is included in the price (3x a day).

The trip takes about 27 hrs.. if I remember correctly, we left Sweden in the evening and arrived in England late next evening. And the price isn't exactly cheap, but it saves you from a lot of riding.

check out About DFDS - Northern Europe's leading transportation provider - DFDSSeaways.com/Freight

If you need more info on this, just ask here or PM.
This idea would have been tempting if we had known about it but after extensive (obviously not extensive enough) searching we could not find a direct passage so booked last year the Newcastle/Ijmuiden outbound and Esbjerg/Harwich return ferries.
(I hate the long haul back so will be making one hit to Esbjerg from Oland Island and then one hit Harwich to Home (Outskirts of Peterhead , Aberdeenshire) to reduce the 'depression' to 2 days.
For my future guidance , how do they load/carry the bike ?
27 hours is a long time for that trip but , as you say , it would have cut out a lot of riding time/fuel and hotel costs.
 

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I don't know how they handle bikes at dfds, but I would assume they do it similarly to others. Bikes are at the side or somewhere, basically away from trucks etc. They provide lines, tie-downs or what ever they are called and you tie it down yourself. They probably check it and tell you if it's enough.

When we took the ferry, weather was great so no rocking back and forth. But the seas can be bad so proper securing is needed.

And if it falls during the voyage, I don't know what they are obliged to cover so that you must ask them, so that it doesn't come as a suprise.

Usually when people take boats from Finland to sweden/germany/etc. Basic securing is enough. The seas are usually calm in the gulf of finland and baltic sea.
 

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I agree with that.
Securing isnt that hard.. just make sure they put you on the left side of the ferry. That way its easier to strap the bike to that side using the sidestand. I usually bring a good rubberband to put around the front brake so it acts like a parkingbrake.



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Ok! Talked to afew friends who go on the ferry alot.
The Helsingør - Helsingborg ferries cross regularly and usually in 30min intervalls during the day. No need to book in advance as its easy to get a spot.

Some of my friends also figured that between the E4 or going north to Halmstad and using the smaller Nissanstigen [26] was more or less the same, since its been straightened. Ill leave it to you to decide. From Helsingborg to Jönköping its hard to find really fun roads.

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Discussion Starter #20
Ok , latest route advice noted , I think we will head for the 26 and go along the west side of the lake. Is it the Frejgatan 28 Ducati Stockholm dealer that has/is closed , if so what is the alternative should we need it ?
 
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