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Ducati wont do valves & belts without doing FULL service?

4K views 28 replies 20 participants last post by  paulmm600 
#1 ·
I bought my ducati last year used, under 7500 miles. I changed the fluids as the manual called for, and called the dealer to have the belts and valves done now that its at 7500 miles.

They refused to do the belts and valves without doing the full 7500 service. Including changing all the new fluids I just put in. So they want me to pay $109 an hour to redo work I just did.

I called ducati NA a few minutes ago and the guy agreed with the dealer!!!!! That because I didnt have the dealer change my oil and brake fluid and coolant, they have to redo it. Drain all the brand new fluids. He said Ducati does not recommend owners service there own bikes.

I asked why they include service instructions in the owners manual if they dont want owners to service their bikes, and he said it was for "reference".

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm so peeved.

Other dealers that aren't so close to me quoted me for just the valves and belts, but I was really hoping to have a reasonable discussion with the local dealer about common sense. Sadly I guess common sense isnt for Ducati. I was really hoping Ducati would have some better standards for dealer support.

I've never heard of dealers refusing to provide factory service if they cant do the cake jobs of changing your fluids also... Never in my life have I heard of such a thing.

And this is supported by Ducati NA.
 
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#6 ·
maybe will void the warranty should something go south if you can't prove the fluids were changed? save the receipts?
Can I Change My Own Oil Without Voiding My Warranty?

"Tie-In Sales" Provisions

From the 2012 US Streetfighter Owners Manual, page 98:

Important

Engine oil and oil filters must be changed by a Ducati Dealer or authorized Service Center at the intervals specified in the scheduled maintenance table reported in the Warranty Booklet.


In the US, The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act prohibits such tie-in sales provisions as follows:

Tie-In Sales" Provisions

Generally, tie-in sales provisions are not allowed. Such a provision would require a purchaser of the warranted product to buy an item or service from a particular company to use with the warranted product in order to be eligible to receive a remedy under the warranty. The following is an example of prohibited tie-in sales provisions.

"In order to keep your new Plenum Brand Vacuum Cleaner warranty in effect, you must use genuine Plenum Brand Filter Bags. Failure to have scheduled maintenance performed, at your expense, by the Great American Maintenance Company, Inc., voids this warranty."


So in the US, you can change your own oil and Ducati cannot void your warranty because of it. The statement in the Owners Manual that oil and filters must be changed by Ducati is illegal and unenforceable in the US.

However, you should be prepared to provide documented proof (receipts etc.) that you changed the oil and filter on the recommended schedule and used a quality oil and filter if later a lubrication related repair issue develops.

From the 2012 US Streetfighter Owners Manual, page 7:

However, warranty does not apply to the motorcycles used in competitions or competitive trials or whenever poor maintenance status is ascertained.
 
#4 ·
Go to a different dealer...

Last year I had to change oil myself in San Diego because the local dealer couldn't get me in (and it was due then), but Ducati Seattle was happy to finish the (non-desmo) service and reset the light when I got there.

I also had my 60k desmo service done by a non-Ducati Shop (Moto-Z, they have a respected Ducati tech) and Bob Weaver (Ducati dealer) in Buffalo were OK with doing the computer checks and resetting the service light.
 
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#9 ·
It's a 2010 Streetfighter. Well out of warranty. Bought it with low mileage and it took a little while to get to the mileage based service.

I;'m not looking for them to cover anything except stand by the job they actually do, i.e. valves and belts.

Half the stuff on the 7500 mile service is time based regardless of mileage, and have the stuff is mileage based regardless of time.

So most of the stuff had to be done before 7500 miles anyways.... many times in fact.

I'm less peeved at the dealer than I am at Ducati NA for standing by this. I called ducati NA in California and the guy told me the same thing. They wont perform any service unless they can do everything the book calls for that hasn't already been documented as being done by a dealer.
 
#7 ·
Well it would help if we knew the year and model and if the bike is in warranty.

If not in warranty find a good dealer elsewhere of find one of us independent shops , in your area the local Duc owners will know where you might find one with a good reputation who will work with you. There is a good reason Ducati owners are used to traveling great distances for service, the dealer network is a mixed bag of great shops crooks and Boutiques. Not all shops work for all people but it sounds like you are a hands on person so look around and ask for the one that will work for you.

You are 100% right on Magnuson-Moss but the dealer and Ducati have quite a bit of control. unless you plan on lawyering up Dealers will make the rules up themselves. MOST are great people who want your business but there are a few.... in the long run this is good info for you as now you know what shop to avoid with all future purchases.

Know that there are a few items where they do need to drop fluids (coolant and some times oil) to do a service and some will NOT put any fluid back in after they drop it no matter how good it is. By the fact you were asking about a 7500 mile service I am thinking it is a older bike not in warranty anymore?
 
#10 ·
What all fluids are you referring to? Just looking for some clarification. I've not worked on a streetfighter, but have a multistrada 1200 (similar motor). You have to drain the coolant to remove the radiator which you must do to get to the horizontal cylinder. Depending on the location of the oil cooler, I'm guessing you have to remove it as well. Most dealerships will use the proper engine turning tool which requires removing the cover on the alternator cover. At this point, you have definitely drained the coolant and most likely drained the oil. If it were a desmodue, it would be a different story.

I think it might be a misunderstanding that boils down to these fluids need to come out to do the work. Sucks you just replaced them, but this is where you are. If they are wanting to replace brake and clutch fluid and service the forks, I can fully understand telling them to pound sand. Otherwise, I think they are not necessarily out of line. Disregard any BS that Ducati NA said.

Lastly, I stand by my previous statement of considering doing it yourself.
 
#11 ·
The fluids were more of an example. There's just a long long list of crap that I dont want to pay them $109 an hour to do.

Lots of things to "check" that I'd rather them not touch at all, if it were free. Let alone pay them to do.

For instance: "Check chain tension alignment & lubrication". I dont want to pay someone $109 hr to service my chain.

Also, "check brake pads change if necessary". I dont want them messing with my brake pads. and I don't want to pay them $109/hr to "check" them either.

I had the wheels off last summer for new tires and torqued them to spec. I dont want to pay them to retorque the wheel nuts.

Nor do I want them to service my battery.

Its just a whole lot of dumb crap I dont need want, that's going to add up quick.

Lots of service is also due for time based service. Forget 7500 miles. Pretty much all of it. If they wanted to go nuts with this "Ducati calls for it we have to do it" they could certainly rake me over the coals. I dont think they will, but it still makes me nervous that they have this mindset.... I can see it now, "We didnt know you were beyond the time limit on these service items when we quoted you over the phone...."

And yea, it's really upsetting that ducati wont service my bike at all, unless they get to be the sole service provider. That's insane to me.

I am considering doing it myself. I did the valves on the Rotax engine in the aprilia shiver I had years ago. Is this one similar? Does it have tappets and such? I've also read that by the time I buy all the stuff I'll need to do the valves and belts that I might as well pay for the service.

Thanks!
 
#12 ·
The valves are a bit different. They are not tappet style. They are desmodromic which has two shims per valve (one opener and one closer) plus half rings. As for cost:
LT Snyder: $40
Shim kit: $300
Other tools you HAVE to buy: $0. I'd consider the cam locking tool, but not required.
This is significantly less than the labor costs for the work, plus you have it for next time. It will be a decent bit of work. It will probably take you ~15+ hr your first time thru. The next time will be half that. Provide you location and you might find somebody on here that is willing to lend a hand and teach you how to do it. Buy the book and see if its within your abilities/interest.
 
#18 ·
Well then...you have options!

There's this independent shop up in NH that supposed to be pretty good: Clubhouse MotorSports :wink2:

There's a couple dealers (one offers winter tech seminars on valve clearance adjustments)

There's a couple enthusiastic shade tree mechanics
 
#17 ·
Find an indy shop that you can trust. That will not give you this crap.
Easier said than done, but I consider mine as good as gold. :smile2:
 
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#19 ·
Do it yourself. I just completed my first valve adjustment on my 99 ST4 which included pulling the cams to check for flaking rockers. Ordered my shim kit from Mike at EMS and my belts from Desmotimes. Was really nice having the shim kit as most of my valves needed to be shimed, plus the satisfaction of knowing just what my clearances are. According to some opinions some dealers won’t adjust them if they are within Ducati’s specs. Some of my openers were at .008 which is at the far end of being in tolerance, everything is at .004 now. Lots of help on this forum and some good Utube videos. Looks like you’re doing most of the maintenance yourself already.
 
#22 ·
Well I bit the bullet and payed the dealer almost 1200 bucks to do the 7500 mile service.

Got the bike back. First ride, 2 miles down the street, the rear brake locked up, the line burst at the caliper, and caught fire. Melted the speed sensor wire before fizzling out.

After the line blew out there the brakes weren't locked up anymore. So I'm inclined to think its probably not a sticking caliper...

Called the dealer and they shrugged it off as a coincidence..... Said the caliper probably locked up.

Ordered Galfer rear brake line and pads, and also a used speed sensor off ebay.

Going to be interesting to see what the problem was..... maybe they screwed with the adjustment on the master cylinder. I don't know.....

sigh..... :-(
 
#24 ·
I really don't know. The receipt didnt say test drive. The Ducati checklist for 7500 mile service says to test ride. But it seems like they didnt do everything on the 7500 check list. Which is funny since they insisted they cant do a partial service. Has to be everything they said.... (Roll eyes)

The checklist says they should "Check and adjust brake and clutch controls"

According to the receipt all they did to the brakes was "check brake pads".

I specifically didnt want them to screw with the brakes..... and here I am. All because Ducati USA "wanted to be sure everything is done right. So we require dealers to do the full service."

I really doubt this is just a huge coincidence.
 
#26 ·
generally that only happens when there is no freeplay at the pedal.

the attitude is appalling. if a bike came back that quick to me i'd instantly assume i fucked up. calipers don't lock up.

i worked at a dealership for 14 1/2 years, and the general shit we got from people really used to piss me off, as we put a lot of internal systems in place to raise the level and consistancy of work. and then you get this sort of thing and it's no wonder people used to assume we were fuck wits.
 
#27 ·
It only takes one guy with a bad attitude working in a dealer to drag the whole place down, or at least the department he works in. I drive farther to get to a good parts guy. I’ve had warranty work done at Harley dealers, but I don’t go to the dealer who didn’t tighten my seat down. When I got my tires installed ( first time ) the mechanic told me what he’d checked, Condition of drive belt and brake pads, the tire pressures, etc, I felt like at least the guy had been thorough. Someone who actually was trying to earn my business.
 
#28 ·
I strongly suspect its free play at the pedal. It makes the most sense. I dont think a frozen caliper would release when the line burst..... I could bring it to them, hope they're honest, and fix the problem for free if its their mistake. Or if they say its not their mistake (which the guy did over the phone, immediately), I'm on the hook for 500 or so dollars for them to repair the melted brake and speedo line at oem dealer prices, including fancy bike Ducati bike labor. (How do shops have different shop rates or Jap/italian bikes I dont know..)

Or just pay 100+ bucks for (aftermarket and used) parts and fix it myself. Correctly.

This is exactly why I didnt want them screwing with my bike. It literally caught fire in traffic 2 miles down the road.

As an aside, anyone know how to remove the stains from brake fluid on my Marchesini wheels? I rode home (2 miles) with no rear brake. Washed the brake fluid off with dish soap and water as soon as I got home, and it still stained my wheels...

Worst 1200 I've ever spent in my life. IF anyone is wondering all my valves were in spec... BARF....
 
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