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I just signed up for next year's VIR 2 day session... any Multi pilot with experience at the school have any insight regarding how difficult/easy it is to adapt to the S1000RR? I don't have sportbike experience and I don't want that to cause issues with getting the most out of the weekend. They also have F800ST's and I need to decide which way to go. The S1000 obviously is a better power matchup to the Multi (and Streetfighter which I may have by then)... I doubt the F800 power drop would really limit what I get out of the class by much. I spent some time riding the F800GT in Germany last year and it was a lot of fun.

I wish they'd just let me ride the Multi.
 

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I would suggest the 800. I feel it would let you get used to being on the track, and let you put more of your concentration on learning what you need to, without being totally overwhelmed by the insane performance the 1000 is capable of. Make no mistake, the S1000RR is nothing like your Multi.


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Discussion Starter #3
I would suggest the 800. I feel it would let you get used to being on the track, and let you put more of your concentration on learning what you need to, without being totally overwhelmed by the insane performance the 1000 is capable of. Make no mistake, the S1000RR is nothing like your Multi.
I'm not worried about performance as much as ergonomics... I can turn up the nanny aids on the RR if it needs taming, but if it takes too long to get comfortable with the aggressive riding position then that would be a problem. I've ridden the F800 and it's a bit more aggressive posture than the Multi but I was riding it like a whipped horse within 15 minutes on the B500 (it was easily the most comfortable/natural position I've ever been in for hard riding, just slow down the straights).
 

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I'm not worried about performance as much as ergonomics...
For me its related to your body type (arm length, torso length) and your core strength. Core strength is key b/c if you rely on your arms to hold your body weight, you'll get really uncomfortable fast. The other area is the neck, sportbikes require extra effort to keep your eyes up.

I find sport bikes to be pretty comfortable, I can usually ride all day on them. But definitely not for everyone. On a track your legs will be exhausted but I find that to be true on any style bike.
 

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Dave, I’m sure you are an experienced street rider but how much track experience do you have? I’m guessing not a lot just because you’re asking.

Just a couple of things to think about here. On the track the ergo’s of a sport bike make since. The more powerful and faster the bike the more you’ll appreciate it. But wrestling with way more weight, power and speed than you’re prepared for will wear you out physically and mentally. And yes, on the track the 1000 is a big heavy bike for a novice rider.

You mention how much fun you had on the 800. You will have way more fun on the track than the street and the speed down the straights won’t hold you back even a little bit. If you do go with the 1000, and assuming your limited track experience, don’t be too shocked to find that more experienced riders on R3’s and N400’s are running 30 seconds a lap faster. No kidding.

Ride what you’re comfortable with and have fun. We’ll need a write up after you get back.


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don’t be too shocked to find that more experienced riders on R3’s and N400’s are running 30 seconds a lap faster. No kidding.

Ride what you’re comfortable with and have fun. We’ll need a write up after you get back.
My guess is that for CASS, everyone will be on the same bike and with an instructor. I've not attended the school, but I don't think its structured like a typical track day.
 

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My guess is that for CASS, everyone will be on the same bike and with an instructor. I've not attended the school, but I don't think its structured like a typical track day.
Dave did say they can choose between the little 800 twin or the S1000RR. But the point I’m trying to get across is for someone that it might be their first time on a track, high hp and speed down the straights won’t teach you how to get around a track fast. It’s just the opposite. Sure there’s the giggle factor of nailing 180 hp on the straights but that’s usually followed by sheer terror when you get to the next turn. :)

On a less intimidating bike you get to breath on the straights and actually think about what’s coming up and what to do. You get in front of the bike rather than behind it. You get to look for that braking marker, actually think about how to use the brakes while leaned over and when to release them, think about what gear you need to be in, look for that turn in point, the apex, what the tires feel like leaned over, the exit point and where you want to be when you come out of that turn. Rather than screaming in your helmet because you’re going faster than you thought and you are already in that next turn without a plan.

These are things I’ve always thought I knew until just this last year when I decided to get back on track. I’d forgotten what it really takes to turn fast lap times. And just twisting the throttle ain’t it. :)




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These are things I’ve always thought I knew until just this last year when I decided to get back on track. I’d forgotten what it really takes to turn fast lap times. And just twisting the throttle ain’t it. :)

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You realize your talking to a guy who did his very first track day on a 1299.;)
 

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Discussion Starter #9
My guess is that for CASS, everyone will be on the same bike and with an instructor. I've not attended the school, but I don't think its structured like a typical track day.
Yea it's not a track day... it's two days of training covering aspects of bike handling. It's not even really specific to track riding... a while back I started watching Keith Code's videos and I've not seen better tutorials for learning advanced handling (which is as valuable on the street as at the track). I think there are some levels that are focused on track (code race or something like that) but the 4 initial levels (you take one level per day) are on skills development.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Dave did say they can choose between the little 800 twin or the S1000RR. But the point I’m trying to get across is for someone that it might be their first time on a track, high hp and speed down the straights won’t teach you how to get around a track fast. It’s just the opposite. Sure there’s the giggle factor of nailing 180 hp on the straights but that’s usually followed by sheer terror when you get to the next turn. :)

On a less intimidating bike you get to breath on the straights and actually think about what’s coming up and what to do. You get in front of the bike rather than behind it. You get to look for that braking marker, actually think about how to use the brakes while leaned over and when to release them, think about what gear you need to be in, look for that turn in point, the apex, what the tires feel like leaned over, the exit point and where you want to be when you come out of that turn. Rather than screaming in your helmet because you’re going faster than you thought and you are already in that next turn without a plan.

These are things I’ve always thought I knew until just this last year when I decided to get back on track. I’d forgotten what it really takes to turn fast lap times. And just twisting the throttle ain’t it. :)
I definitely was asking for input because while I'm very comfortable riding on the street I've zero track experience and even more importantly I don't have sportbike experience so I don't know how long it takes to adapt. I've got a lot of miles on the street and quite a few miles riding fun twisties... and I know I'd learn what I need to learn on the F800 (as I said... I found it to be far more fun to ride than the R1200GS's I usually rent in Germany even with 40hp less)... at the same time I'm planning to pick up a SFv4 next year so I WOULD like to get some experience on a more sport focused bike - but ONLY if it's not going to take me half the $2500 weekend to get comfortable.

I'll have to mull it over some more... have lots of time... but I did sign up and send in the deposit.
 

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You’ll have a blast no matter what you’re riding. If you’re doing the two day school I know you must use their bike. I thought the 1000 was all they used.

Believe it or not I did Code’s school the first year or two after he started doing it. Somewhere around ‘77-‘79 or so. We rode GPZ550s back then. That’s how I got my WERA license. I’m sure it’s changed a lot since then. :)




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You’ll have a blast no matter what you’re riding. If you’re doing the two day school I know you must use their bike. I thought the 1000 was all they used.

Believe it or not I did Code’s school the first year or two after he started doing it. Somewhere around ‘77-‘79 or so. We rode GPZ550s back then. That’s how I got my WERA license. I’m sure it’s changed a lot since then. :)




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I just signed up for next year's VIR 2 day session... any Multi pilot with experience at the school have any insight regarding how difficult/easy it is to adapt to the S1000RR? I don't have sportbike experience and I don't want that to cause issues with getting the most out of the weekend. They also have F800ST's and I need to decide which way to go. The S1000 obviously is a better power matchup to the Multi (and Streetfighter which I may have by then)... I doubt the F800 power drop would really limit what I get out of the class by much. I spent some time riding the F800GT in Germany last year and it was a lot of fun.

I wish they'd just let me ride the Multi.
I'd go with the 800, I have taken CASS level 1 & 2 as one day classes on the multi and done several track days on my multi as well as Daytona 675R. As others have said CSAA is not a track day, the pace is slower, skill development based, and they give you a lot to think about each session. I believe starting with a bike you are comfortable on will allow you to get more out of it. I’d love to do more CASS classes, but will only do them as single days so I can ride my bike. I’ll do some more track days on the Daytona but will probably wait a year and a half so I can ride my V4 Multi for CASS classes.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
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I'd go with the 800, I have taken CASS level 1 & 2 as one day classes on the multi and done several track days on my multi as well as Daytona 675R. As others have said CSAA is not a track day, the pace is slower, skill development based, and they give you a lot to think about each session. I believe starting with a bike you are comfortable on will allow you to get more out of it. I’d love to do more CASS classes, but will only do them as single days so I can ride my bike. I’ll do some more track days on the Daytona but will probably wait a year and a half so I can ride my V4 Multi for CASS classes.
Did they explain why the won't let you do 2 day sessions with your own bike? Seems odd that you HAVE to ride theirs. I don't care about the money it seems like for skills training I'd be better off on my own bike.
 

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Did they explain why the won't let you do 2 day sessions with your own bike? Seems odd that you HAVE to ride theirs. I don't care about the money it seems like for skills training I'd be better off on my own bike.
The skills aren't particularly bike dependent. I did a lot of track days on my B12 with and without instruction, then switched bikes with my buddies. The 800 is much closer to your MTS in config, so that for sure makes more sense. You'll have more control, go faster around corners, and come away less fatigued. Enjoy! Just be aware that in the days following any street riding will seem VERY slow, but this is a good thing.

There is no better way to increase street riding safety than track instruction done right.
 

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I'm not worried about performance as much as ergonomics... I can turn up the nanny aids on the RR if it needs taming, but if it takes too long to get comfortable with the aggressive riding position then that would be a problem. I've ridden the F800 and it's a bit more aggressive posture than the Multi but I was riding it like a whipped horse within 15 minutes on the B500 (it was easily the most comfortable/natural position I've ever been in for hard riding, just slow down the straights).
Dave,
Have you tried to get a test ride on an S1000RR? If you find a shop with a new, old-stock one you can usually get them to let you ride it, even if just for an hour or less. Some of the sporty bikes are not too bad comfort-wise. I've not ridden the S1K but I've ridden Ducatis and I own a Gen5 ZX10R. The 10R is surprisingly comfortable for a high-velocity missile. Have fun-
 

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I'd go with the 800 you have some time on. Agree with Duckman.

I did the school circa 1992 at Laguna Seca. I think they were using Ninja 600's. At that time I had never ridden a bike with clip ons or low bars, so that was an issue for me comfort wise. Due to weather we did not get that much track time, and it was only a 1 day deal. I would have been happier on a bike with a normal handlebar, but oh well.

Went to a local bar after and apparently the testosterone was oozing from me. It was a lucky night.
 

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Dave, my wife has done a level 1&2 2 day session in Las Vegas and level 3&4 2 day session at Laguna. She did all of them on the S1000RR without any drama and in fact said the 2 days at Laguna were the most fun she had ever had in her life. If you want to ask her questions send a PM to Focker or ping me for her email address or phone number.
 

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I have ridden VIR many times, both on my own bike and a couple of times on the S1000RR at the CASBS. Go with S1000RR; it's comfortable, fast and very controllable. Presumably, you'll be riding the North Course and there's an uphill section T7-10 and on an 800, you'll likely creep up that hill, unless you're a master of corner speed, because T7 is a sharp right hander at the end of the straight. Most people overbrake the turn, are in too high a gear and putt-putt up the hill. The S100RR will forgive you, the 800 won't. With the 1000 you can crush 150mph on the front straight...on the 800, forget about it.
 

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Dave, my wife has done a level 1&2 2 day session in Las Vegas and level 3&4 2 day session at Laguna. She did all of them on the S1000RR without any drama and in fact said the 2 days at Laguna were the most fun she had ever had in her life. If you want to ask her questions send a PM to Focker or ping me for her email address or phone number.
I am thinking of doing one of the Las Vegas 2 day schools. What did she think of that? It's hard to find information on what the circuit is like.
 
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