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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hey folks! New to forums, so feel free to lay into me but >:)

I have an opportunity to buy a 2013 821 SP for a great price. I currently have a 2013 KTM Duke 690 and see this as a direct upgrade.

I rode the bike for about 4 hours last weekend and absolutely loved it. I do have some questions, and I'd love some feedback on what my first steps should be.

Details:
-11k miles
-Stock Exhaust
-Hyperstrada heated grips (integrated into the ignition)
-Lowered Seat (she's a tall one!)
-A few goodies like engine cover, sliders, etc
-Mostly stock!

The bike did stall at one point while clutch-in in 2nd gear rolling to a stop sign. I'm assuming this is the Evac Canister and plan on removing it ASAP. It also had a little trouble starting sometimes (had to hold ignition in for a good 5 seconds while it coughed to life) but it has been sitting in this guys garage for a few weeks.

The bike was surgey at stable throttle and between maybe 3k-7k RPM's. It isn't as bad as my 690, but it felt like the bike was gently bucking back and forth as if I was on wavey pavement.

Lastly, with the stock exhaust, it sounded pretty..muted. It actually felt like most of what I was hearing was the sort of chokey sound of the exhaust and not much engine. It sounds like the full Termi with all the bells and whistles (map, etc) is the way to go, but I can't afford all that upgrade. While I know a simple Slip on would mainly be for audio-improvement, would I be wanting to remap/retune the bike for a slip on?

Lastly, the rear brake was essentially un-usable. I needed to stand up to get the lever pushed far enough to actually activate. Not sure if this is air in the lines, horribly misadjusted (is it just a simple wire that needs tightening?), or if something is wrong. You could get the brakes to bite if you stood up and really pressed the 4" or so, but it was unusable while sitting. Any suggestions on fixes?

Would love any other hints, tips, or what to look for. I'm hoping to get my 690 sold in the next couple of weeks and have the Duc back under the legs!
 

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Some bikes had an issue with the starter motor, but also the battery, in my experience, only lasts a few seasons. Sounds like one of those two things. A battery is a lot cheaper. Did it start easier when warmed up?

The exhaust in stock form is plenty loud to me. Is the flapper opening? If not, that might also affect the surgy feeling you're having.

These bikes are also sensitive to chain adjustment - on the sidestand the chain should just NOT touch the bottom of the swingarm when pushed up. If it's loose the bike will feel like it's surging.

Sounds like the rear brake needs a bleed. You have to remove the rear wheel, remove the caliper and hang it above the master cylinder and bleed from there. A bit of a PITA, so maybe it wasn't done.

It could also be that the pads are worn through - it happens quicker than you think - ask how I know.

No idea on the stall.

11k is not many miles - if there's a decent service record - this is a sturdy machine.

My 2 cents.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Awesome thanks appliance. The rear brake is likely not the pads, as the travel is just way too far. Even if the pads were worn, I can't imagine I'd get 3-4 extra inches of travel. It just does absolutely nothing for the first 3". There is something else there regardless of the pads.

I only started the bike about 3-4 times. Once when I first got on, and twice while out riding/warm. It didn't seem to change once warmed up, but I remember sometimes it sparked right up, others it coughed a bit. It did remind me slightly of my old Audi 80s when the starter motors would start failing, but I'd rather hope it was just unused for a few weeks/months and needed to be ridden again.

Chain + exhaust sounds like two good checks on the surgeyness. I don't mind it too much, but if it can be fixed I'd love to have the bike feel smooth in a straight line.
 

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Dont have that exact bike but i would suggest getting that battery upgraded to a lithium one as they are super light and put off way more cold cranking amps. Just be weary of letting it sit as they go bad easily. Good excuse to ride more.

The surging is normal, most people gear the bikes differently, which helps. Just a tooth down up front makes a big difference. Also a tune to richen it up with performance upgrades such exhaust and intake will also help it jump to life a little quicker.

The stalling could be many things and is something I am sure someone else will chime in on. Evap can should def come off.

Bleed the rear brake, but keep in mind both my Ducati's have extremely weak rear brakes and it may just take some getting use to.

Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I had a buddy with a horrid experience bricking LiOn batteries. Wanna avoid them in case it sits :D It was not a fun experience haha.

As for the rear, I am used to having an almost-useless rear brake on most motorcycles. I really just like it for hill starts and trail braking into corners. But this one literally doesn't engage even the slightest until you almost snap your ankle off trying to push it far enough. The brake lever is past 45 degrees by the time it engages even the slightest bit, and then it works normal. It definitely either just needs adjustment or has a ton of air in it..or maybe it's got something wrong. Not really sure but it just feels like, if it were a bicycle brake, that you have to adjust the wire from all the way loose to all the way tight!
 

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I had a buddy with a horrid experience bricking LiOn batteries. Wanna avoid them in case it sits :D It was not a fun experience haha.

As for the rear, I am used to having an almost-useless rear brake on most motorcycles. I really just like it for hill starts and trail braking into corners. But this one literally doesn't engage even the slightest until you almost snap your ankle off trying to push it far enough. The brake lever is past 45 degrees by the time it engages even the slightest bit, and then it works normal. It definitely either just needs adjustment or has a ton of air in it..or maybe it's got something wrong. Not really sure but it just feels like, if it were a bicycle brake, that you have to adjust the wire from all the way loose to all the way tight!
My rear brake isn't that bad, and I don't think it has to be that bad.
 

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Awesome thanks appliance. The rear brake is likely not the pads, as the travel is just way too far. Even if the pads were worn, I can't imagine I'd get 3-4 extra inches of travel. It just does absolutely nothing for the first 3". There is something else there regardless of the pads.

I only started the bike about 3-4 times. Once when I first got on, and twice while out riding/warm. It didn't seem to change once warmed up, but I remember sometimes it sparked right up, others it coughed a bit. It did remind me slightly of my old Audi 80s when the starter motors would start failing, but I'd rather hope it was just unused for a few weeks/months and needed to be ridden again.

Chain + exhaust sounds like two good checks on the surgeyness. I don't mind it too much, but if it can be fixed I'd love to have the bike feel smooth in a straight line.
Another thing you can check is the plugs. The top one is hard to get at (you have to remove the gas tank), but the front one is easy. If the front is good, sadly you still know nothing about the top, but if it's dirty - there's something that could make things harder to start, and maybe cause a stall.

This is just guessing, and they should have been replaced at the 9k service. I replaced mine, though they were fine - now i have spares.

One other thing - these bikes take a pretty precise wrist - if you were in race/sport mode the ratio between twist and go is pretty low. Touring is more leisurely while giving full power. May have something to do with the smoothness of power delivery. For me - my wrist got more precise, my revs up, and I've forgotten what another bike may be like - so I'm fine- unless the chain is loose...
 

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Hey folks! New to forums, so feel free to lay into me but >:)

I have an opportunity to buy a 2013 821 SP for a great price. I currently have a 2013 KTM Duke 690 and see this as a direct upgrade.

I rode the bike for about 4 hours last weekend and absolutely loved it. I do have some questions, and I'd love some feedback on what my first steps should be.

Details:
-11k miles
-Stock Exhaust
-Hyperstrada heated grips (integrated into the ignition)
-Lowered Seat (she's a tall one!)
-A few goodies like engine cover, sliders, etc
-Mostly stock!

The bike did stall at one point while clutch-in in 2nd gear rolling to a stop sign. I'm assuming this is the Evac Canister and plan on removing it ASAP. It also had a little trouble starting sometimes (had to hold ignition in for a good 5 seconds while it coughed to life) but it has been sitting in this guys garage for a few weeks.

The bike was surgey at stable throttle and between maybe 3k-7k RPM's. It isn't as bad as my 690, but it felt like the bike was gently bucking back and forth as if I was on wavey pavement.

Lastly, with the stock exhaust, it sounded pretty..muted. It actually felt like most of what I was hearing was the sort of chokey sound of the exhaust and not much engine. It sounds like the full Termi with all the bells and whistles (map, etc) is the way to go, but I can't afford all that upgrade. While I know a simple Slip on would mainly be for audio-improvement, would I be wanting to remap/retune the bike for a slip on?

Lastly, the rear brake was essentially un-usable. I needed to stand up to get the lever pushed far enough to actually activate. Not sure if this is air in the lines, horribly misadjusted (is it just a simple wire that needs tightening?), or if something is wrong. You could get the brakes to bite if you stood up and really pressed the 4" or so, but it was unusable while sitting. Any suggestions on fixes?

Would love any other hints, tips, or what to look for. I'm hoping to get my 690 sold in the next couple of weeks and have the Duc back under the legs!
Yes, get rid of the evap canister, unplug the flapper valve. Can't comment on the brakes. You mention the full Termi with upmap? You won't get that done in California, where it appears that you are located.

A do it yourself RapidBike EVO fueling module and a 14T front sprocket is what I recommend.

You committed to buying it? Asking because it seems to me from reading the Ducati boards, this one and the Hyperstrada board, that most people who have had multiple problems with the 821 machines, and even got Ducati to take them back under the lemon law are the 2013 & 2014 year bikes.

Just the way it seems to me, but wait...someone will come along and call me a liar.:wink2:
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
It's definitely not just throttle. I am weirdly sensitive to all the controls. It was definitely a surging in the engine. I was testing the roll on/off point and it surely has some peppiness to it, but nowhere near as bad as my 690 or my old SV before I took out the secondary throttle valves.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I'm really hoping that isn't the case with my bike :) It ran very clean in general, and feels very well put together. It seems like the occasional 821 has some real issues, but I don't know that this is one of those. It has 11k miles with very little problems thus far.

The rear brake (which seems very fixable), the 1 random stall (which my 690 loves to do every couple weeks), and maybe some throttle cleanliness.. otherwise it seems quite good.

I don't know that I'll need the fuel mod, and we'll see about the sprocket. I liked the gearing but I've only ridden it once. After the 690 with a usable rev range of about 3k, it feels more like my SV650 and I love being able to stick it in 3rd gear for the twisties instead of banging it up and down gears constantly. I am indeed in CA. I am not gonna buy the Termi as it is, that would defeat the whole "a cost efficient upgrade" aspect of this :D

The flapper valve doesn't throw codes when disabled? Was reading that elsewhere. And what does that do specifically? From my understanding, it has a wastegate of sorts that flips down during idle to keep dB's down?
 

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I'm really hoping that isn't the case with my bike :) It ran very clean in general, and feels very well put together. It seems like the occasional 821 has some real issues, but I don't know that this is one of those. It has 11k miles with very little problems thus far.

The rear brake (which seems very fixable), the 1 random stall (which my 690 loves to do every couple weeks), and maybe some throttle cleanliness.. otherwise it seems quite good.

I don't know that I'll need the fuel mod, and we'll see about the sprocket. I liked the gearing but I've only ridden it once. After the 690 with a usable rev range of about 3k, it feels more like my SV650 and I love being able to stick it in 3rd gear for the twisties instead of banging it up and down gears constantly. I am indeed in CA. I am not gonna buy the Termi as it is, that would defeat the whole "a cost efficient upgrade" aspect of this :D

The flapper valve doesn't throw codes when disabled? Was reading that elsewhere. And what does that do specifically? From my understanding, it has a wastegate of sorts that flips down during idle to keep dB's down?
Yeah, I hope you're getting a good one. The mods I mentioned are the ones that I have done to my own bike and, all of them have made a huge difference with the exception of the flapper valve disconnect, not sure about that one if it's done anything or not.

I unplugged the flapper valve power source when I installed the RB EVO unit. No problems or error messages.

If your riding mostly on surface streets and twisties as I do, the 14T is huge. It really doesn't raise the RPM's very much higher at freeway speeds either. When I did mine, I posted that my RPM's at 83 MPH for the 14T is 6K RPM in 6th gear.

You can search here about the RB EVO modules, and see that people love what they do for the lean surging characteristic of these Hypers.

I really like the tone and sound of the stock exhaust and would never consider changing it.
 

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Shameless plug: I am selling my 2014 SP in the south bay area. It has all of the 'issues' addressed, including a custom fuel tune, starter motor upgrade, Termi/Ducati intake, 2015 clutch upgrade, etc that I documented in detail on the forum(s). It starts up fast every time. No surging or dead spots at any speed. Check out the classified section.

As others mentioned, the bike you're looking at likely needs a starter replacement, fuel module, and a proper brake bleed assuming it's not seized. A lot of people complain about Ducatis not having good rear brakes, but I've never had an issue myself. I personally think that only a few exhausts look good on this bike, like the Termi low. The Termi low does have a cat built in though.
 

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Shameless plug: I am selling my 2014 SP in the south bay area. It has all of the 'issues' addressed, including a custom fuel tune, starter motor upgrade, Termi/Ducati intake, 2015 clutch upgrade, etc that I documented in detail on the forum(s). It starts up fast every time. No surging or dead spots at any speed. Check out the classified section.

As others mentioned, the bike you're looking at likely needs a starter replacement, fuel module, and a proper brake bleed assuming it's not seized. A lot of people complain about Ducatis not having good rear brakes, but I've never had an issue myself. I personally think that only a few exhausts look good on this bike, like the Termi low. The Termi low does have a cat built in though.
If I was to buy one, I would buy this one sight unseen.

That said - I think the bike doesn't necessarily need all the add ons, but the OPs bike had a couple of quirks and I'd pull the plugs and check the service record.

My strada has none of those things and rides fine. I will do the clutch upgrade when this pack goes, and I'm curious about other stuff - but it's a very good bike as is - for me.

The Arrow also looks very nice on the bike https://www.motovationusa.com/ducati-hypermotard-821-exhaust-by-arrow.html
and can be had with a cat.. I wouldn't ride without a cat..
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Shameless plug: I am selling my 2014 SP in the south bay area. It has all of the 'issues' addressed, including a custom fuel tune, starter motor upgrade, Termi/Ducati intake, 2015 clutch upgrade, etc that I documented in detail on the forum(s). It starts up fast every time. No surging or dead spots at any speed. Check out the classified section.

As others mentioned, the bike you're looking at likely needs a starter replacement, fuel module, and a proper brake bleed assuming it's not seized. A lot of people complain about Ducatis not having good rear brakes, but I've never had an issue myself. I personally think that only a few exhausts look good on this bike, like the Termi low. The Termi low does have a cat built in though.
Hey kuk sent you a PM. Likely I'm trying to get this mostly stock SP and live with the lack of mods and slowly figure out what needs upgrading

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Yeah, I hope you're getting a good one. The mods I mentioned are the ones that I have done to my own bike and, all of them have made a huge difference with the exception of the flapper valve disconnect, not sure about that one if it's done anything or not.

I unplugged the flapper valve power source when I installed the RB EVO unit. No problems or error messages.

If your riding mostly on surface streets and twisties as I do, the 14T is huge. It really doesn't raise the RPM's very much higher at freeway speeds either. When I did mine, I posted that my RPM's at 83 MPH for the 14T is 6K RPM in 6th gear.

You can search here about the RB EVO modules, and see that people love what they do for the lean surging characteristic of these Hypers.

I really like the tone and sound of the stock exhaust and would never consider changing it.
Interesting. I'll prob look into the fuel mods at some point but I'll to stick with the canister to start.

I really didn't like the stock exhaust. I'm not one for loud bikes but it barely sounded like a twin. Felt very muted and sort of high pitched rather than throaty and low that I expect from a twin

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
 

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Hi, I have a 2013 with 41K on it.

Check the forks. The early 2013 had a run of defective legs. BTW the Marzocchi's are sub-par even when they work. Andreiani's are worthwhile improvement.

Rear brake; I tried a bunch of pads brands.My favs are SBS pads that have nice feel. Also, get a folding adjustable tip from woodcraft https://www.woodcraft-cfm.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=08-7899A. It makes all the difference. The stock setup is awful you can't raise the pedal and your foot ends up a useless angle by the time the brake bites.

I have a Shorai lithium battery. Works great.

2013 - 14 had awful clutch from standstill. You can retrofit the later parts for not too much $$$.

I've always fantasized about having boots that deployed extenders when you stop! The height............. i think my legs are getting shorter?

Hey, have a blast........I still do!
 
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