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quick review of the article?

I should be getting this in the mail fairly soon!
 

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naturally....lol

but! if you were to put that motor in a Bimota, and charge 50k, and everything else be the same, it would get raving reviews....lol
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Remember those old spy movies where Bond and others took pictures of files? Don't know if they still do that, but I took some pics of the article and posted for you herein.

Keep in mind the entire piece is about 20 pages. My posts total about 6 pages. And don't be bitchin about the lack of quality. :mad: I was not going to spend more than about 15 minutes on this.

Lastly, the article was a comparison of superbikes on the track, NOT street use.

http://www.heartinsanfrancisco.com/bests.jpg

http://www.heartinsanfrancisco.com/dynojet.jpg

http://www.heartinsanfrancisco.com/scorechart.jpg

http://www.heartinsanfrancisco.com/streetuse1.jpg

http://www.heartinsanfrancisco.com/streetuse2.jpghttp://www.heartinsanfrancisco.com/streetuse1.jpg
 

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Very interesting that the 999 really doesn't have a torque advantage over the IL4's...particularly the GSX-R and the CBR. That surprises me. Also interesting that, at least by the numbers, the R1-LE was beaten by the base R1 all up and down the chart. Not significantly, but consistently.

That CBR seems like a damned sweet bike.
 

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I was impressed that the 999S was tied with the best time of the test with the R1 LE and had a better time than all the others.I thought the new CBR and ZX10R would have killed the Duc with the hp and weight advantage but the 999S was right there(time wize anyway). Of course it finishes last because of price and etc etc... Everybody knows the Ducati is the most $$$ so it will always be last if that is part of the judgement on the bike.
 

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rob said:
Very interesting that the 999 really doesn't have a torque advantage over the IL4's...particularly the GSX-R and the CBR. That surprises me. Also interesting that, at least by the numbers, the R1-LE was beaten by the base R1 all up and down the chart. Not significantly, but consistently.

That CBR seems like a damned sweet bike.
It shouldn't surprise anyone that the I-4's produce more torque than the twins. Torque is a function of displacement and both bikes have the same displacement. The fact that the I-4's have a smaller bore diameter means that they will have better thermal efficiency. The smaller surface area of the cylinder means less heat is lost to the cylinder walls leaving more heat in the cylinder which makes the burn more efficient. The biggest falacy in the motorcycling comunity is that a twin produces more torque than a four cylinder, it doesn't. It produces more tractable power due to the seperation of pulses from the cylinders.

What was interesting is that most of the riders thought the $7K for the Yamaha LE wasn't worth it for the street, but they essentially tested the Ducati version of the LE in the S version.
 

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The fact the riders thought the R1-LE offered no improvement tells me 2 things:

The R1 chassis is getting very long in tooth -- rumor mill has it getting SERIOUS makeover in '07 similar to the '06 R6 which would likely make it the ultimate liter track weapon.

The R1-LE was likely not properly setup as frankly the stock KYB forks have pretty awful compression damping, loads of stiction, too soft spring rating and excessive rebound damping. I've not ridden an R1-LE but I suspect the Ohlins forks, if properly setup, would be dramatic improvement over the KYB fork.

The other interesting piece is the wide disparity in rider skill, at least witnessed by their relative lap times. The fastest rider, by a good margin, was fastest on the Ducati followed closely by the Gixxer. The slowest rider, by a VERY large margin was also fastest on the Duc, actually same speed with CBR. The balance of riders generally struggled on the Duc which leads me to believe they were unfamiliar with V-twin powerband and Ducati handling. I've always thought it takes a skilled rider to get the best out of a Ducati while most any squid can turn decent times on a Japanese 4...at least till they do something stupid as those bikes are generally less forgiving.

While I suspect the fastest rider is far more skilled than I, my own personally experience on these bikes is identical. I always felt the R1 and ZX10R feel capable of greater speed, their relative stabilty setting up for a turn under braking and stability through the turn caused me to be less agressive and thus resulted in slower times. My only CBR1000RR experience was on the '05 which was an absolute dog, its nice to see the new version have some guts and hopefully turns a bit quicker.

This comparison only proves these bikes are all amazingly fast and further proves, the fastest, most skilled rider is going to be the fastest rider regardless of his/her weapon. Take care.
 

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being that every rag always dogs on the ducs for being more expensive....even though it's fastest....even though it weighs more....and even though it has less power.....has always irked me.

Yet, they will talk all day about how the I4s are worth the money...because you can run just as fast...???

and I agree about it taking a skilled rider...everything I've ever heard is that it takes a learned rider to ride the ducs, but once you know them, you can school a lot of people out on the track
 

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Nearly every article I have read here in OZ always end with " Which bike of these would I prefer in my garage " the most common answer is always the Ducati... Why?? "because it's the Ducati..." they also say, " it's not the fastest, most economical, comfortable or have the most power, but it IS the Ducati nad you need to have one, at least ONCE "

Mal
 

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RotoRooterGuy said:
Lastly, the article was a comparison of superbikes on the track, NOT street use.
Does it not say "on the street" right on the cover or am I halucinating?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
SP3 said:
Does it not say "on the street" right on the cover or am I halucinating?
Your post implies that my comment lacks foundation or is otherwise incorrect. Alas, you are simply not reading the pages I posted and basing your assumptions on the cover pic. No big, you are just making assumptions without all the facts, a common mistake.

The cover does say that they did comparisons on the Track, Dyno, and Street. But if you read the other pages I posted, the ones labeled "street use," you would have seen that the authors said that while their comparisons were based on track use, they were also including the short piece on street use since some subscribers used the compared bikes on the street.

They specifically said that "street ride was NOT part of the criteria used for the overall shootout rankings and in fact we did NOT pick a best street bike, we simply rode the bikes and reported on what we found about each."

In other words, all they did was put their riders on the bikes and comment on what each of them personally liked and disliked.

Of the approximately 20 pages of material, this "street use" article comprised 3/4 of one page. IMHO, given the lack of depth on the street use piece 1.5 columns, sans picture, plus the article's disclaimer, they probably should have not included "On The Street" on the cover as it apparently confused some people into thinking the mag was doing a streetbike review rather than comparisons of superbikes on the track.

End of taking you to the woodshed
 

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Street, track, whatever...

Ah, all I got's to say in my wisdom is SCREW THEM!

Nothing rides, sounds, or feels like a Duc.

And the Kawisuzahondaha all kinda feel and sound the same.

And they don't look like MINE!

HA!
 

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I hear ya man.

I feel the same way.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Rainman said:
Ah, all I got's to say in my wisdom is SCREW THEM!

Nothing rides, sounds, or feels like a Duc.

And the Kawisuzahondaha all kinda feel and sound the same.

And they don't look like MINE!

HA!
As the owner of Japanese bikes and a Duc, I have to say:

You are right.
 

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RotoRooterGuy said:
As the owner of Japanese bikes and a Duc, I have to say:

You are right.
Yet, the point of the article is which bike will make the best race bike. I think it is tough to argue, with the higher cost of buying and maintaining the Ducati , that the 999 would make a good platform for a club racer.

Tony
 

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on that aspect, sure...I can see a Suzukawiyamiduh being the obvious choice

but for street and everything else, absolutely not.
 

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Sure the point was taken.
But then that is a known quantity going in.
So if that factor (cost) was a known variable, then don't include it.

So what if it handles better or gets better times, and then eliminate it for cost.

Any squid out there riding knows it.
I don't see them riding wheelies on a 749 or 999 down MY highway.....
 
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