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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all. Im in the interesting spot of my rebuild where im starting to piece the engine back together. Im ditching the 1.6m. Id like to put a p8 in there, but i dont have an exact parts list for it. I know theres a few ECU's out there that can run the injectors independently MoTec being one of them, i just cant find one for a reasonable price. So if theres anyone who has a parts list, or an ecu reccomendation, im all ears. The engine is a 2000 996. 13:1 Pistals, 1mm squish, 108/108 timing, 50mm termi exhaust.

dont worry the white is going away. Its going to be a forarty when im done, being that the frame is a 98 916.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
The big thing for me is independent injector control. The My ECU looks promising, but i took the PC III out of my bike because it ran best with a zero map and a chip.
 

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For some reason I though the PC-III could run maps per cylinder.

Search the forum. Somewhere on here is a thread from a member who hooked up a PC-V to run a map for each cylinder and explains how he did it.
 

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pc-iii will do individual cylinder control, but corey wants to run each injector individually. personally i don't see a reason for it.

if you think a motec is too expensive, finding all the 2000 my 996sps parts you need to make this work will also be too expensive i expect.
 

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pc-iii will do individual cylinder control, but corey wants to run each injector individually. personally i don't see a reason for it.

if you think a motec is too expensive, finding all the 2000 my 996sps parts you need to make this work will also be too expensive i expect.
This. And........
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I’m trying to understand how the motec works. So any model motec will work, and it comes with a harness that you adapt to yours?
 

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Call me an idiot, it's ok, but if you are mapping each cylinder that would mean injector control for the fueling. If the PC-III has issues with the 996 twin injectors per cylinder, then I understand. Though the PC-III works fine on an I4, perhaps the problem is the 996 2 injectors per 1 spark rather than the 1 injector to 1 spark of the I4s.

I'll not share my opinion on the subject matter of this thread. This is post 3, and it's not been easy.
 

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I dare say the problem isn’t getting a pc3 to work, the problem would be how to map. When do you fire the second injector an how much juice to give it. I’d go with the Jeffries and fire one injector per cylinder.
 

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Call me an idiot, it's ok, but if you are mapping each cylinder that would mean injector control for the fueling. If the PC-III has issues with the 996 twin injectors per cylinder, then I understand. Though the PC-III works fine on an I4, perhaps the problem is the 996 2 injectors per 1 spark rather than the 1 injector to 1 spark of the I4s.

I'll not share my opinion on the subject matter of this thread. This is post 3, and it's not been easy.
the pc3 has a connector that screws into the throttle body connector, so it will modify the signal to both injectors per cylinder which fire together.

i believe corey wants the ability to control each injector individually, which the 1.6m ecu in conjunction with a ducati spec'd pc3 can't do as it only has two injector channels as such.

do the pc3 for 4 cylinder bikes allow all 4 cylinders to be mapped individually? if so, he could use one of them to modify the signal to each injector individually, but that basic control over the injectors remains with the ecu, which will always fire them as a pair per cylinder.

that's what i think he is trying to overcome, and the only ecu that will allow him to control all 4 totally independantly is a motec afaik. or maybe a ignijet, not sure if it can run 4 injectors individually. the p8 can't run 4 individually either, it has them paired, but staged.

what's wrong with sharing your opinion?
 

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no idea, never used one. you could buy it from pete smith at epicycle, he has a lot of experience with them.
Pete Smith fitted an M4 Motec to my 916SP back in 97. Works a treat. Great guy.
I have a M800 fitted to a 1098R & a M1 fitted to a 1198RS hybrid. The M1 is a better option than the M800 for the big twins as it can handle the sensor info better of the acceleration / deceleration of the crankshaft during cranking when starting. But saying that they both work well.
 

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Motec is obviously the dog's danglers but there is a cheap PClll option that allows you to map each injector separately: use a 1098R unit.

From the 1098R PClll manual:

"In the PCIII software you will have the ability to map 4 different tables.
TABLE 1 - front cylinder primary
TABLE 2 - front cylinder secondary
TABLE 3 - rear cylinder primary
TABLE 4 - rear cylinder secondar
y"

You can find it here if you're interested: http://www.powercommander.com/downloads/736/install/411/eng736-411.pdf

You won't get anything like the functionality of a Motec but you still have some options like the "accelerator pump" function if your TPS is compatible and you can plug and play a quickshifter.

Edit: not sure if it's what the OP is after but I was thinking you could basically have 2 x injector signals (single injector input paralled across primary and secondary injector inputs for each cylinder) into the PClll and 4 modified injector outputs.
 

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Not sure how a 1098R PCIII would work without the same ECU...

Seems all this is a lot of work and I'm not sure to what end. Should be a nice motor, but it's a bit silly to chase a couple extra ponies out of something that won't approach an RS or anything . It's based on a Strada, so it won't have resale value, even as a Foggy replica. If it's to be a great long term keeper, then you could keep the hardware stock and I think Doug Lofgren can burn a chip. If you decide you really want to extract every last bit, then start rewiring and go Motec or Microtec.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I’m really just looking to have a bit of fun. The way I see it is I only have 3,000 into the bike, and it needed to be torn down anyways. I know it’s not worth it, but I’ll enjoy it. I do plan on keeping it long term
 

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You probably won't need a second injector for this motor. Amullo might have a single injector mod chip for a setup close to yours that can improve the ignition timing and get fueling in the ballpark. From there, you can just use a simple PCIII and someone local-ish like MotoCorse Performance to tune it for you. If you actually do max out the duty cycle of a single injector per cylinder (which you shouldn't unless it's partially clogged), then you could either up the fuel pressure (half-assed IMO) or have the injectors bored for increased flow rate and have them tested/matched. That way you know they can provide more than enough fuel and your base level will be even. RC Engineering did a set for my built 996 motor in the 851, which is running single injector throttle bodies. Although since I was using a Microtec and starting with a complettely blank slate, they brought my injectors from 330 to 450 ccm. For your motor you could go from 330 to 350 or 360. Then perhaps start with -5% across the board on the PC3 and tune from there.
 

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The motec option is a headache, i did it on mine and if i had my time over i would have looked elsewhere, expensive, overly complex and very difficult to find people who really know how to use it ( read, set it up for you and tune it ).

After paying through the nose twice i sat down and learned how to do it myself, rewarding? no, necessary? yes. The motec site has a forum which can be helpful but most of what i needed was specific to my application and a lot of the Motec guys are into cars, not bikes.

I run an M400 and it's very good, but in hindsight not worth the cash, time or effort let alone the agro of being ripped off by certain unscrupulous so called experts.

I have a P8 and an injection harness (888) if you want them, not sure the harness is exact for your application but it's likely very close, Brad Black would be able to tell you if it will work or not.
 

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no idea, never used one. you could buy it from pete smith at epicycle, he has a lot of experience with them.
interesting you post this, i haven't been able to find ANY epicycle web pages for years, and Pete doesn't even answer his phone anymore, if he's not completely retired i'd be surprised, when i first got started with my Motec install i tried in vain to contact him, he moved to the central north coast a couple years before and his contractibility was patchy at best, then all his on line docs disappeared and i've had no luck since.
 
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