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Discussion Starter #1
My 06 999R track bike has developed an odd issue. The bike has run well in the past, but after sitting for 2 months has recently developed an odd problem. It starts, but will not idle nor will it rev out. While running when blipping the throttle, the revs will rise, but there will be a significanty lag between the rise in revs and the tach needle moving up the scale. The needle also stutters and jumps on the way around the dial.

I thought there may be a fuel delivery issue (the engine seems very flat, like it is starved of fuel) but swapping the fuel tanks with a good 999 did not have any effect. My current thinking is electrical, maybe an intermittent ground to the ECU. I have a power commander on the bike, but removing it completely had no effect. I will try to get an error code from the dash and will confirm all battery connections are tight, but has anyone ever had similar symptoms from their 999?

Does the tach get its signal directly from the crank position sensor? I have had a bad CPS on my 888, the signal breaks up with high revs, but this is different. The location of the ECU on the 999 makes working on it a pain and I am afraid that tugging the wiring loom left and right to look at fitting a race radiator has screwed something up.
 

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Check the crank sensor to ensure it hasn't come loose? Try unplugging the PC to makesure it's not giving a dirty signal.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks. I did lessen the air gap on the crank sensor at some time in the past in an effort to try to cure the problem. I will check it again. The power commander has been removed with no difference.

The quest continues.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Ok, the quest gets more interesting. By pushing the button on the left side of the tach face and turning the key on I got the error message 1.2 which according to my manual corresponds to FARF/TPS CC GRD(?) Now the manual suggests that the first column or "FARF" means the input (?) and the second column "TPS CC GRD" means the output. CC means short circuit and grd means ground.

What does FARF mean? Does this mean that my TPS has a bad ground? Could be, or maybe the bad ground is at the ECU? There are 3 wires going into the TPS, none seem a ground, my suspicion remains that there is a badly grounded ECU in there somewhere.

Wish I had a set of ponts and some big Dellortos.
 

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....Does this mean that my TPS has a bad ground? Could be, or maybe the bad ground is at the ECU?...
It should mean that your TPS has a short circuit to ground!

I found a more readable version of the error codes, that has helped me before:

1.1 TPS Disconnected
1.2 TPS short circuit to earth
2.1 Pressure Sensor short circuit to power supply
2.2 Pressure Sensor shorted to earth
3.1 Water Temp Sensor shorted to power supply
3.2 Water Temp Sensor shorted to earth
4.1 Air Temp Sensor shorted to power supply
4.2 Air Temp Sensor Shorted to earth
5.1 Battery Hi
5.2 Battery Lo

10.1 Hor. Coil shorted to power supply
10.2 Hor. Coil shorted to earth
11.1 Ver. Coil shorted to power supply
11.2 Ver. Coil shorted to earth
12.1 Inj1 shorted to power supply
12.2 Inj1 shorted to earth
13.1 Inj2 shorted to power supply
13.2 Inj2 shorted to earth
14.1 Inj3 shorted to to power supply
14.2 Inj3 shorted to earth
15.1 Inj4 shorted to powersupply
15.2 Inj4 shorted to earth
16.0 Pump Relay
17.1 LH Fan shorted to power supply
17.2 LH Fan shorted to earth
18.1 RH Fan shorted to power supply
18.2 RH Fan shorted to earth
19.1 Starter Solenoid shorted to power supply
19.2 Starter Solenoid shorted to earth

30.0 ROM/Eprom error
34.0 Signal Panel Sensor
36.0 Speed sensor
37.0 Immobiliser (transponder)
37.1 Immobiliser (antenna)
37.2 Immoiliser (instrument panel serial driver)
37.3 Immobiliser (serial cable disconnected)
37.4 Immobiliser (ccm serial drive)
37.5 Immobiliser (key not recognised)
37.6 Can Line error

I hope you find the cause of your problem.

Best regards
Soren
 

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Discussion Starter #7
OK, the problem worsens. With the ECU error code in hand (1.2) I thought that the TPS was shorting to ground somewhere. I pulled the battery wiring box off the left side of the bike (BTW may I add that the bettery ECU box is an INCREDIBLY stupid design, with all that crap crammed into a small space) and checked it for chafing wires, etc. Nothing visable.

I then pulled the power commander completely off the bike and reinstalled the standard ecu to TPS connector at the back of the airbox. And turned the key. (I note that the bike still displays error code 1.2 - I suspect it will show that until cleared by the DDS machine) I hit the starter button. Nothing. Although the fuel pump runs and the relays click and the needle on the tach runs through its cycle and the idiot lights come on, there is no click to the solenoid when the starter switch is depressed. Yes the on/off switch is on "on". Yes, the sidestand plug is jumped (I took an hour to look through it). Yes, all the electrical plugs are all plugged in. Yes, the battery is charged (even if it was not, it would still click at the solenoid, no?) Yes the main fuse (all the fuses) are tight and unbroken.

So, I am fresh out of ideas. I wondered if I needed to use the red key after I undid the battery and removed and reinstalled the ECU. Could that be the issue?

Under what circumstances does the red key need to be used? Assuming that could be the issue, what are the symptoms? I suspect the dash lights will all come on as ususal, but the starter motor will not engage? I did not check the dash for a "code" error light. Maybe tomorrow.

Did I mention that I hate the security system on the 999R? Is there a way to replace all that crap with a toggle switch marked ON and OFF like on my 888/9555 Corsa? Is there a way to trade a 999R with less than 400 miles on it for a nice reliable R1?

Grrr....
 

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Discussion Starter #8
A few other ideas and questions.

If it is the immobilizer, and I need to enter the electronic code from the card which came with the bike, I understand that I turn the key and open the throttle all the way for 8 seconds. Then it flashes, then I twist it after counting the flashes. and repeat until the code is entered. But do I need to use the red key to do that? Or can I do the whole process with the black key?

As well, error 37.5 does not show up when I depress the left side toggle and then turn the key. Does that mean the key is not the problem?
 

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Discussion Starter #9
OK, the immobilizer was the problem preventing the engine starter motor from engaging. So it turns over and starts now. The engine still runs as poorly as ever missing, jerking and not able to idle. Still shows that error code 1.2, but no obvious tps to ground shorts (the tps itself is mounted on plastic inlets so I assume the short is not inside the airbox. So I am back to square 1.

I am considering a swap of throttle bodies from another 999 to help isolate the problem, I have a 999S to borrow from but have no idea if the 999R has the same throttle bodies.

Track day this weekend, will be on a borrowed Suzuki (again).

As there is no ducati dealer here, I am considering my options. Someone make me an offer.....
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Spoke with JHP who built the engine. Seems to be the injection relay, part no 541.4.003.1A, which sits at the bottom underside of the battery box, under the ECU. A cheap part.

Will find out tomorrow. Fingers crossed.
 

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My 06 999R track bike has developed an odd issue. The bike has run well in the past, but after sitting for 2 months has recently developed an odd problem. It starts, but will not idle nor will it rev out. While running when blipping the throttle, the revs will rise, but there will be a significanty lag between the rise in revs and the tach needle moving up the scale. The needle also stutters and jumps on the way around the dial.

I thought there may be a fuel delivery issue (the engine seems very flat, like it is starved of fuel) but swapping the fuel tanks with a good 999 did not have any effect. My current thinking is electrical, maybe an intermittent ground to the ECU. I have a power commander on the bike, but removing it completely had no effect. I will try to get an error code from the dash and will confirm all battery connections are tight, but has anyone ever had similar symptoms from their 999?

Does the tach get its signal directly from the crank position sensor? I have had a bad CPS on my 888, the signal breaks up with high revs, but this is different. The location of the ECU on the 999 makes working on it a pain and I am afraid that tugging the wiring loom left and right to look at fitting a race radiator has screwed something up.
On the 999 all sensors (crank, speed, temperature etc) run to the ECU which in turn converts the signal to digital form and send the data to the instrument cluster via a single wire CAN-BUS line.

I'd be looking carefully at any component you've disturbed. Poor rev-out and no top-end can also be related to a weak spark.

These issues may not be related, if there is a problem on the CAN-BUS line between the ECU and the Instrument Panel, all readings are likely to suffer. On the other hand a crank sensor issue will cause poor runing (possibly like you've described) and also affect the tacho operation.

However, on the 916/996/98 bikes there have been instances of the tacho becomming unresponsive due to internal corrosion and fatigue. When the needle stutters does the engine run smoothly. What I'm saying is your instrument panel may have moisture (or corrosion) in the internal connectors and / or an earthing problem.

Poor running can be due to blocked injectors, bad spark plugs or a faulty crank sensor and a myriad of other causes. Bikes that sit for extended periods can suffer from thier lack of use.

I've seen Ducati's have electrical gremlins diagnosed as all sorts of things but in reality it was just moisure causing corrosion in the connectors in the wiring loom which in turn was causing the poor running.

I don't have a 999 so I'm not sure if the instrument panel will reveal the error code for sensors, you may need to quiz the ecu directly. The error codes are ideal for this type of diagnosis.

Regardless of the error codes, clear then and re-run the bike and then check them again (often there will be more than what is necessary on the first reading and the second reading will reveal the true culprit component). This should point you in the right direction for remedying the situation.

Also check all electrical connectors are clean and free from corrosion, then put diletric grease into them and re-connect. Check all fuses are good (i.e good contacts and also apply the diletric grease) then move onto all the chassis earth points.

If you still have not found a solution, then drain the tank and partially fill with fresh fuel, replace the spark plugs and add some injector cleaner to the fuel tank, run this through the tank and then fill the tank with fresh fuel.

Andrew...
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thanks for the suggestions, when my frustration subsides I will try a few more things. FWIW, I swappped the injection relay, the new one makes strange clicking noises and buzzes when the key is turned, but the bike will not run. Apparently something may have destroyed the old relay and is hurting the new one we borrowed from a running 999.

The only thing I can think of is a defect in the wiring harness whereby there is a short to ground somewhere. As mentioned, error 1.2 suggests a short to ground in the TPS circuit, but I have swapped the entire airbox/throttle body/TPS unit with another and the problems remained. Thus the defect needs to be downstream of the millitary spec tps wire connector at the airbox.

My choices seem to be to either pitch the complete harness and get another or undo all the tape and visually check it with the aid of an ohmmeter. Neither option seems attractive as I have examined the wiring closely and found no defects and to buy a new harness is not a guarantee that the problems will be solved.

Anyone want to buy a 400km old 999R display model cheap?
 

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Hell ya, Ill take it. As the owner of a 999R with intermittent electrical problems I feel your frustration. Plus I know how you feel with the dealer not being in a position to help you either. It sucks being stuck behind a sand dune sometimes.

I take it you know your way around a toolbox......

Here are some things I will do if I was you -
Replace your sparkplugs
Make sure the springs in the ignition coils are in the right way.
Trace the wires to the coils and make sure there are no damage or bad connections.
Do a TPS reset
What is the voltage on the battery? (you want over 12 v minimum before you start it)
What is your charging voltage? (Anything over 13.3 upwards at idle is a good start)
There are no blown light bulbs anywhere on the bike? (replace them if there are, a blown tail light once caused the bike to refuse to start)
You have swapped the fuel tank over, so I will assume there is no clogged fuel filter issues and fuel lines are not kinked
Both the two grounds are OK (Check that one on the ECU is on proper)

Who did your last belt change and how sure are you that the cams are within spec?
Do a compression test on the cylinders to rule out a mechanical valve related issue

If this does not solve the problem, then it is electrical hunting time.

Get a wiring diagram and chase each and every single connection pin from the ECU to its input source and mark it off on the diagram.(At least two days worth of work and do it right or dont bother) Check the wires around the triple tree, they have a tendency to pick up damage.
Check the internals of the starter switch

If this still does not sort it out, rip the harness out and undo the electrical tape. Check each and every wire and connection pin again. Replace the harness and try it again.

Final resort is a match and an open parking lot

I am serious, if you want to let that bike go, give me a shout. I am across the pond over in Doha.

Hope you get the bike sorted

SF
 
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