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Discussion Starter #1
As I am approaching the beginning of my 4th quarter, I am pairing things down (guns, motorcycles, watches etc.) to gain maximum enjoyment of a fewer amount of things that are exactly what I want and to simplify.

I have searched and read many observations on the 1260 and wanted to get clarity from those that have ridden both the 1260 and the 1200 DVT, mine is a 2016 S Touring - so I can either investigate upgrading or put it out of mind.

My options on riding the new bike are either a 3 mile rectangular loop around the interstate in Northern Colorado or a 10 minute ride in HEAVY traffic in downtown Denver. Insufficient to analyse the subtle differences.

There are three things that might be important to me on the new bike but I am not sure.

1. Handling - At 8k miles on my 1200 I never realized that I had a bike that was unstable :), I never ride over 90 like I used to. I would appreciate comments on this , it appears that the new bike is optimized for the highway and not sport riding, or perhaps like BMW adding a steering stabilizer to the GS, Ducati realized they could improve safety with the new geometry and it is an upgrade???

2. Engine performance, while all the new updates gradually made the dip better it is still only a minor annoyance, a smoother power curve is definitely more desirable and I have no doubts the 1260 fixed this issue, the slightly increased horsepower has little value for me personally although it is nice to see Ducati accurately representing HP for a change. It appears the 17 airbox swap is inconclusive and there are no real Dyno's (without other variables introduced) to prove it had any effect, the very experienced mechanic at the dealer told me to save my money. The real question here is does the Full Termignoni with the up map fix the dip. The Dyno test I was able to find suggest that there is no real benefit here except weight savings, aesthetics, and sound, and it does not address the dip. These can be had direct from Italy on sale for 1680 for the full system without the upmap key - I wonder if the key will cost 700 when I take it to the dealer for the upmap. Here is the dyno's I found https://www.ducatiforum.co.uk/threads/dyno-comparison-standard-v-termi-exhaust.37412/

3. Quick shifter _ I am sure this is nice and better although I never had any issues shifting, just like Honda's DCT is nice, I prefer automatics on cars and actually consider shifting part of the joy of riding a Ducati - perhaps I am missing things here and if it were free I would probably get it.

4. Better Dash - I am sure it is better but I am perfectly happy with the one on the 1200 S Touring

5. It accepts Ducati's big aluminum boxes - nice to know but if I wanted these I would get the SW Motech Trax adventure which appear to be superior.

6. Seat - As I have spent a fortune on a custom seat and then a TT Ducati comfort seat with a pad strapped on I imagine the seat on the new bike is not transformative.

7. Screen - I have a California Scientific Medium for cool temperature and a PP Carbon for summer so this is probably optimized -

Thanks for reading this long post - I wish it was 20 degrees warmer outside and there was no ice on the shaded parts for the roads in the high country.
 

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Here's my $.02. I didn't feel it was worth the upgrade from the 2014 I had which as you may recall does not have the DVT motor. I do think they've made some nice changes to the bike but none worthy of upgrading and taking the financial hit. I DO think they've made the engine more usable with the 1260 and if there were any reason for switching that would be it. My new bike has a quick shifter and I have to consciously think about using it and unless I'm trying to rail up the mountain, I don't have use for it.

It's a shame Erico(?) won't let you take the bike out for a decent loop.

Me personally, I went away from Ducati on my last bike purchase (3 weeks ago now?), but there were two things I wanted and buying another Duc was only going to address 1 of those. I don't say that b/c I think anyone else should do it, I just mention it for transparency.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for the response Gadgetech, Erico is a great shop and where I bought the bike - I think they are all bound by insurance hassles - as you know it would be a long journey from there to get a proper evaluation without massive traffic.

The Ft Collins shop years ago when I bought my first bike from them used to let me take it all day and I would go up Poudre Canyon and have a proper eval.

I am curious - what did you get. I have slimmed down to only my DVT and an 09 GS for my road bikes.

If I had to go to one only it would be a tough call - I think it would have to be a new r1250 GS - ride the road (Trailridge) to Steamboat and back over Buffalo Pass (gets a bit rocky and is 30 mile of dirt rocks gravel) and back home through Poudre Canyon - Then again it would be tough to give up the thrill of the Ducati.

This is the kind of rides I like and will not take my DVT over the rocks/dirt/pass.
 

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Thanks for the response Gadgetech, Erico is a great shop and where I bought the bike - I think they are all bound by insurance hassles - as you know it would be a long journey from there to get a proper evaluation without massive traffic.

The Ft Collins shop years ago when I bought my first bike from them used to let me take it all day and I would go up Poudre Canyon and have a proper eval.

I am curious - what did you get. I have slimmed down to only my DVT and an 09 GS for my road bikes.

If I had to go to one only it would be a tough call - I think it would have to be a new r1250 GS - ride the road (Trailridge) to Steamboat and back over Buffalo Pass (gets a bit rocky and is 30 mile of dirt rocks gravel) and back home through Poudre Canyon - Then again it would be tough to give up the thrill of the Ducati.

This is the kind of rides I like and will not take my DVT over the rocks/dirt/pass.
I've ridden my DVT on quite a bit of dirt... and it does it but it's not like the the GS - it's not really happy on it. If I rode more than 10-15% dirt I'd have a GS (or a KTM)... but at my balance of 'some dirt fire roads but mostly tarmac' I'd not want to give up the Multi top end. Not that the GS is slow, but while I've not ridden the 1250, I don't believe it will change the 'grunt' dynamic of the bike... lots of low end torque but wheezing at the top end.

I personally didn't notice much difference between the 1200 and 1260... just like I didn't notice much difference between the earlier 1200 and and the DVT. IMO it's pretty subtle, bit smoother, bit more power, maybe a tiny bit slower handling. Perhaps a pro would have a stronger impression of change. If I was in the market for my first multi I'd definitely get the 1260... but I'm not worried about upgrading from my 15 (until the 15 dies anyway).
 

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OK, I’ll thow in my 0.03 (AUD) FWIW.

Have a 1260S with touring pack (having come from a 2017 S - was “forced” to update due to my own stupidity and after exceeding the design limits of cornering ABS).

First up, engine. Power neither here nor there. Torque improved sure; dip in curve - I’m not that sensitive. End result is an easier ride with less cog swapping. I have the full Termi system with up map - like you say, aesthetics, and weight saving; predominantly noise though - if you don’t like gunshots on quick up shifts and a whole lot of crackling and popping on off throttle overrun then maybe you shouldn’t get one. Not the friendliest on a early morning in a quiet country town (can’t get enough of it though! :)...

Speaking of the quick shifter - up works really well and is great everywhere. Down, way less so; great when it works, doesn’t more often than not. It is not a patch on my Panigale 1299S QS unfortunately - hopefully Ducati will fix/improve it with a software update.

Handling. My 1200S was too soft in touring mode for our back country roads. I made the front and rear harder to stop mid-corner wallowing on bumps. Never had an issue with high speed stabilty (and I did go to the upper limits). On the 1260S with the longer wheelbase I think Ducati has revised the default suspension tune appropriately and I’ve found no need to change it as yet (I’m about 75kg with gear, 1.78m, and approaching my last 1/3 :). Maybe not quite as “flickable” as the 1200 but it is still relatively easy to drag the centre stand and test the lean angle limits.

To me the 1260S is more of an incremental update and I enjoy all the little improvements such a self-cancelling indicators, QS (up) and subtle things like the air flow around new side panels seeming to not direct as many bugs into the bars, brake reservoirs, switch blocks, mirror stems, etc. Console is much easier to use and the bluetooth connectivity much improved. (Word of warning - Ducati changed the GPS connector slightly so re-wiring the GPS cradle connection is needed.)

Panniers appear to be the same, can’t say about the top box as I’ve never had one.

Seat - standard in high position. Haven’t bothered changing even after 400km+ days. Standard screen with a Palmer Products adapter (with bar for GPS mount); works for me and minimises bug splatter on visor. The 1260S seems quieter in this configuration than the 1200, but that could be due more to the new helmet...

To sum up, for me the end result is an all around more “relaxed” coherent ride. (YMMV of course).

Is it worth updating from a earlier DVT; the head says probably not (but since when did the head have the last say?)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

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Personally, I wouldn't consider trading a 2016 for a new model. The upgrades are nice, but not worth the financial hit you'll take. Only two of them, the engine and the QS, approach that level of significance even in theory. The engine is legit, but it also lost some of it's sportbike roots in the upgrade. It just doesn't have that peaky power delivery any more.

The QS is, as others have noted, at best a mixed bag. If you want one on a 2015+ MTS, it's the only game in town unless you're willing to hack your wiring harness. It works, but not nearly as well as a quality aftermarket QS, or even the factory unit on some other Ducatis. The best thing about the 1260 quickshifter is that you can turn it off.

I enjoy my 1260, but trade in a 3 year old MTS for one? No way.
 

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I would keep your 1200 DVT until the V4 multi comes out in 3 years .
 

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Since I am in the cusp of making this purchase, this has been great insight. I however have had the good fortune to ride a 2013, 2017, and a 2018 1260s all back to back.

If I already owned a DVT I would not bother with the 1260. The biggest difference I saw/felt was where the torque comes in between the 17 and 18’. It was noticable to me that the torque on the 1260 was about 750-1000 revs earlier than on the previous 1200 DVT. I had the 18’ for a couple of days and got to ride it on twisty roads against the previous year models. The slower “tip-in” on corners is slightly noticable to me, but I did notice it. It was not enough to worry about. The 1260 just seems to come out of the turn much harder and effortlessly than the previous models. I would look down at the speedo and be seeing triple digits coming out of a marked 35 mph tirn.

The seat is more comfortable and seems to fit my arse better than my current 2013. The switchgear is much nicer as well as it has built in cruise control for the times I have to slab it up the freeway to get to the good stuff. The screen of gauges is much nicer as well.

In short, if I did not have 30k+ on my 2013 or if I had a 20116-2017 I wouldn’t be looking at a replacement.
 

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Was there an announcement I missed?
Not exactly, but it's also not pure speculation. The CEO was quoted in an interview several months back basically saying that the large twin days are numbered. The cheaper, less powerful bikes will keep the twin for the foreseeable future, but the MTS and Diavel/xDiavel specifically are going to follow the Panigale into v4 land. He didn't outright say that, but the picture painted was clear.
 

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Not exactly, but it's also not pure speculation. The CEO was quoted in an interview several months back basically saying that the large twin days are numbered. The cheaper, less powerful bikes will keep the twin for the foreseeable future, but the MTS and Diavel/xDiavel specifically are going to follow the Panigale into v4 land. He didn't outright say that, but the picture painted was clear.
I know it’s coming, just wondering how long the wait will be. The 1260 was an update, thought we might see the next gen, V4 in 20 or 21, my 2015 can last that long, not sure she will make it to 23.
 

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Ducati has been following a 4 year update cadence across their lineup for some time now. Sometimes it's 3, but usually 4. I can't think of any refreshes that went beyond 4, in the last decade or so. Maybe one of the Monsters, I don't keep up with them.

If they follow a 4 year cadence, we'd be looking at an early '22 release. I believe it'll be '21, though. The 1260 did nothing to refresh the appearance of the model, which drives sales more than an engine and electronics refresh.
 

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I personally didn't notice much difference between the 1200 and 1260... just like I didn't notice much difference between the earlier 1200 and and the DVT. IMO it's pretty subtle, bit smoother, bit more power, maybe a tiny bit slower handling. Perhaps a pro would have a stronger impression of change. If I was in the market for my first multi I'd definitely get the 1260... but I'm not worried about upgrading from my 15 (until the 15 dies anyway).
This reflects my thinking after putting a few thou on the '15 and test riding the 1260 hard. A few things make any DVT so close to the 1260 it's not worth it, as others have noted.

All the seats suck. I fitted a Sargent this month. Oh g-d, it's sublime. The HP issue is moot, as there's more than enough power all over to pull any car on the road, get yourself in trouble, and then some.

If you're upsetting your MTS on the street handling-wise you need to take it to the track. Properly set up it's at the top of the heap out of the box. Isn't that why we all own one? The V4 talk is making me moist. Such a great motor. Like an unruly VFR with way more power. Why hasn't Honda put one in a sport tourer? Whoops, wrong forum...
 

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This is my plan too.
I'd personally rather see a V4 streetfighter... and keep the Multi as a twin - but you can't stop progress I guess.
 

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As respects performance nothing that's evolved to date has made me itch enough to get off of my '12. Niggles have been abundant but it doesn't take long back on the board to see that any number of those remain regardless of vintage. And they're generally the same ones. Grips, brakes (perhaps solved on the 1260?), fuel senders and tanks (tanks??? Why tanks? Of all the miserable.....), electrical etc.

I missed the 1260 intro last summer and it does look like they got the feature set hammered but have moved a notch closer to a touring spec. Nothing I can find suggests they've improved the gas tanks though, a major gripe and long term peril for my kind of long term ownership. Did I miss the moment when the fuel tanks stopped being a liability or is it too soon to tell?

The 1260 looks like a magic carpet and maybe last of breed but I like the raw edge on the one I have. Still, it's the only one in the whole series of liquid Multis that might hook me. I should probably ride one.
 

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As respects performance nothing that's evolved to date has made me itch enough to get off of my '12. Niggles have been abundant but it doesn't take long back on the board to see that any number of those remain regardless of vintage. And they're generally the same ones. Grips, brakes (perhaps solved on the 1260?), fuel senders and tanks (tanks??? Why tanks? Of all the miserable.....), electrical etc.

I missed the 1260 intro last summer and it does look like they got the feature set hammered but have moved a notch closer to a touring spec. Nothing I can find suggests they've improved the gas tanks though, a major gripe and long term peril for my kind of long term ownership. Did I miss the moment when the fuel tanks stopped being a liability or is it too soon to tell?

The 1260 looks like a magic carpet and maybe last of breed but I like the raw edge on the one I have. Still, it's the only one in the whole series of liquid Multis that might hook me. I should probably ride one.
There are things to like about every iteration of the Multi right from the beginning (and things not to like :) )... I'd love to find a nice low mileage DS someday.
 

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With my '12 approaching 100,000 miles, I'm thinking about buying a new MTS, but haven't got a hard-core answer about servicing that DVT motor....yet. Since I do my own service, and the '12 isn't that bad, I'd like the DVT to be about the same, but am reading its a PIA. Performance wise, I really don't 'need' any more power. Would a V4 MTS be better? I've ridden the Tuono's and luv'ed 'em, but that big twin 'feels' great and servicing the V4.....
 

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With my '12 approaching 100,000 miles, I'm thinking about buying a new MTS, but haven't got a hard-core answer about servicing that DVT motor....yet. Since I do my own service, and the '12 isn't that bad, I'd like the DVT to be about the same, but am reading its a PIA. Performance wise, I really don't 'need' any more power. Would a V4 MTS be better? I've ridden the Tuono's and luv'ed 'em, but that big twin 'feels' great and servicing the V4.....
I also own Tuono 2017 (and used to have 2012 as well). The engine is one of the most complex I've worked on, but you can do all maintains by yourself (I did 4 valves adjustments already), because:

1. Aprilia: Service manual is readily available for less than $10.
Ducati: I tried everything and can't find a service manual for MTS 1260. The only option is to buy Ducati USB stick with all bikes manuals (why do I need it???????? I need only ONE bike!!!!) for $400!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
2. Aprilia: The forum has few very knowledgeable mechanics who are always willing to help.
Ducati: It almost looks like NOBODY is doing their maintains here! Complete lack of information. And whoever does actually know the stuff, keep it TOP SECRET! In general, I'm very disappointed with overall technical knowledge of Ducati forums (at least in DVT area). Far from Aprilia, BMW, Kawasaki, etc.

Anyway, I'm not going to let any Ducati dealership touch my bike (except for warranty, recalls or ECU updates). Too many cases when they screw up bikes. Unless 1260 service manual becomes available (for a reasonable price) by my desmo service time, I'm going to sell Ducati...
 
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