[Gduck]

Well... what started out as a pleasant Sunday cruise (on my '06 mono) up to the Wasp's nest for a full dress rehearsal for our upcoming Phillip Island sojourn (next Monday guy's), all hell broke out !!

About 2k's from the Wasp's my engine check light came on and within seconds bike started to miss badly, lost power and growled like a wild cat Very next intersection, clutch in, engine stall, bump start with remaining momentum, next intersection, clutch in, engine stall, no momentum, hit starter button "click - click", wont turn over

Fortunately for me, the Wasp was close at hand and despatched the "pimp my ride" Wasp mobile for an immediate recovery Cheers Wasp, glad it didn't happen next week, could have been stuck in Adelaide... and who would wish for that (croweaters)

Anyways... back at the Wasp nest measured the battery voltage at 10.5v, no surprise she wouldn't start, but why during an 80k ride ??

After a couple of hours on charge (only a trickle charger available) battery volts up to 11.5v, hit the button started no prob's but no measurable increase in voltage with engine revving looks very suspiciously like the dreaded R/R.

After pushing on all day with PI Ducati transporter modifications (trailers), decided to head on home back down the hill, battery was up to about 12.5v... well, got about 30k's down the track and same-same, missing badly, loss of power and growling like a wild cat :abduct:

Very understanding wife turns up with me ute, and a very helpful passing Can Am Spyder rider/driver whateverer secured the recovery.

Back at my workshop checked through charging circuit, 40A regulator fuse OK, battery voltage present at R/R connector (red and black wires), 50vac alternator voltage present at R/R connector with engine at 3 - 4000 rpm (3 x yellow wires), battery held charge overnight and cranked bike feaverishly during tests and still no increase in battery voltage while engine is running, nothing else to suspect other than dead R/R.

Trip down to local Ducati dealer and $208aus secured new R/R, p/n 540.4.011.1C (original 540.4.010.1A superseded). After install, charging voltage at 14.4v with bike at idle... gotta be happy with that

A short test ride (30min) had the static battery voltage increased from 12.5v - 13.5v, indicating bike is now charging during a run. One observation now though is how hot that sucker (R/R) runs, never checked it previously but after test ride touched it with the back of my hand and "yeeow" I now have sexy fin marks on the back of my hand

I am thinking of adopting one of the mod's from this forum where the r/r was turned upside down and poked through a hole made in the plastic pan to give it some free air.

Thanks to all you guys that have posted up previous experiences with this issue, gave me a lot of insight into diagnosing my problem.

Hope the above provides some help to those that may suffer from similar issues.

Cheers... Gaz
Looking forward to catching up with some of you at PI next week.

 

[MajorSoftie]

That's good news for you, but a sign that the new "superceded" R/R is no better than the original when it comes to running hot.

 

[Stressfest]

A well timed melt down...gotta be happy with that. Kudo's to Mr. Wasp... Is there anything that man cannot do?

 

[GTMuzz]

nice that you were nice n close to help! when mine went i was waiting on the side of the road for about 5 hours for roadside to come.
Has been good for the 10k clicks

 

[GTRossi]

surprised that they didn't cover it under warranty...

the flip-trick of mounting it upside down underneath the seat tray is simple and works great.

just drill out the holes carefully right through the threaded inserts (use a bit just shy of the threads inside) then run a tap through to clean up any nicks/burrs from the drill. your r/r should have enough play in the wire harness to route through a small square gap between the seat pan and the frame near the battery (you'll see it when you look) and then just mount it upside down and run the screws in from underneath. i would also suggest using a few washers to provide some airspace between the back of the r/r and the bottom of the seat pan to allow air flow around the unit and keep it from melting the plastic.

should take 15 min. max, and then if you want you can use the new space in your seat tray for a LiPo battery replacement!

oh, and then you should get yerself a hugger to keep it clean

 

[aeolian]

oh, and then you should get yerself a hugger to keep it clean

And I wonder who makes one....

 

[Gduck]

Cheers for the tip GTRossi, I may carry out your suggestion soon. I'm good for a hugger at the moment as I have one fitted.

Not completely confident my new r/r will survive, the heat it generates seems excessive. As soon as I get off night shift I will endeavour to measure the temp' after a ride to see what it gets up to !

Spoke to the local dealer this arvo' about their experiences and they seemed surprised... no real history locally of S1000's having r/r problems. They did admit they have just about changed out every 1098's r/r that they have sold and that the temp' of mine should not be that excessive !

I'm now thinking that the battery may be a cause for this excessive temp' if it where a little less than at it's prime... excessive charging current will obviously cause excessive temp'. Battery is still the OEM unit, 3 years old, but holds charge and pulls like a train, even during all my testing

Perhaps should just change it out as an insurance policy anyway.

 

[GTRossi]

my local shop has boxes of warranty-replaced r/r units from a range of bikes. it's a combination of how hot they get and where they place them - poor ventilation/cooling = short life for a hot part.

i'm not an electrical guru by any means, but i wasn't aware that the battery affected the r/r as i thought the charging system puts out voltage based on engine revs, regardless of how the battery is doing. not sure how a weak battery would somehow cause the r/r to work any harder...

maybe someone else out there knows better??

 

[dietrichpfeifer]

If anything I would think a fully charged battery would be harder on the regulator because it would have to shed any excess voltage as heat. But...all things electrical seem to work better when the batt is in good shape.

 

[reh]

No, power = voltage x current. And in the case of the r/r the heat given off is the power that is has to dissipate in dropping the voltage from the alternator down to the level to charge the battery.

The battery voltage doesn't fluctuate that much based on how fully charged it is, so the voltage is basically constant. But a full charged battery will need very little current to keep it charged. The flatter the battery (i.e. less charged) the more current that is drawn to charge it up, and then the harder the r/r has to work.

There were problems in the old r/r, but these seem to have been addressed and a new part is available, and now the problem is the bad location of the r/r under the seat where it gets no ventilation and is not able to dissipate the heat properly.

There are a few methods for relocating the r/r in this thread:

http://www.ducati.ms/forums/showthread.php?t=57942&highlight=relocated

 

[dietrichpfeifer]

When I mounted my Power Commander uder the seat I mover the regulator back to make room. Things are pretty tight under there now and my regulator was getting hot enough that I could feel the heat through the seat to the point that it was getting uncomfortable. I cut three large holes (1"?) in the front lip of the plastic tray, wired on a piece of black metal screen secured from a very fancy pen holder from Office Max and it's been great ever since. My reasoning was that there are plenty of gaps for air to get out from under the seat, but the front is closed off so there's not much air flow through the area. The mod definitely dropped the temps of the regulator.

 

[Gduck]

There appears to be a common thread emerging here !!

Cruised up the hill to the Wasp nest to carry out some comparative tests

Just for future reference:
...................................................Gduck mobile....v........Wasp mobile
Battery voltage, ignition off................= 12.8vdc.......-.........12.87vdc
Battery voltage @ idle.......................= 14.2vdc.......-.........14.48vc
Battery voltage @ 4k........................= 14.2vdc.......-.........14.48vdc
Alternator output (3 phase) @ idle.......= 17vac.........-.........19vac
Alternator output (3 phase) @ 4k........= 50vac........-..........54vac

Ambient temp 25 deg C
R/R surface temp after 20 min' ride......= 93 deg C.....-.........83 deg C

Off to the local Duc dealer tomorrow to get an "experts" opinion on wether this thing is gunna survive !!