Three day track tire - Ducati.ms - The Ultimate Ducati Forum
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post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 15th, 2016, 6:50 am Thread Starter
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Three day track tire

Tire advice.

Hi lads, I've a long history with bikes but mostly on the road. I've recently converted my 97 -916 to a track bike. I'm fanatical about tires and was using Pirelli Super Corsa SP's. I absolutely love that tire. The bike will only be on track from now on so the obvious tire choice is the Super Corsa SC which apparently is even better than the SP once warmed up. The problem with this tire is its only gonna last two days on track and the packages I normally book are three days. I'd like to avoid having to fit new tires track side if possible.

This leaves me looking for something that's gonna last for at least three days on track with an intermediate group,middle of the road rider. The big one that jumps out is the Pirelli Super-bike Pro. I've heard story's of that tire lasting up to six days without tire warmers. While being very impressive it also scares the shit out of me. How can a tire perform well on track with that many heat cycles. I'd love to get some fed back on this tire if possible. The other option is to go down to something like a Rosso Corsa 50/50 road/track tire. I'm guessing I'd get three days out of that and still have great confidence and grip. Again any feedback would be great.

I'm open to all tire manufacturers, I was running Michelins for years but that love affair ended with the pilot power three so I switched to Pirelli and haven't looked back since!

Thanks in advance Ö
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post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 15th, 2016, 8:31 am
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Three days will depend on a few things.

track surface- I ride some tracks that are super aggressive and chew the tires up and others where you come off looking like a new tire.

Your riding style- I have had customers running superbikes get 2-3 days as a beginner and later on as they get more corner speed and tend to be more smooth instead of parking it and pinning it their tire life went up by 1-2 days with the same tires on the same track.

Class of tire.

I class tires in this way
race tires
hypersport tires
sport tires

The middle group is the one the pirelli supercorsa SP V2 is in , also is the michelin supersport and Bridgestone RS10, Dunlop does not have a tire in this category. All of these tires are kind of compromise tires in that they are the step between the actual race tires and the sport tires (Dunlop Q3, power 3, rosso corsa). What they have for positives is really good traction and very little warm up time, no warmers needed so if warming the tires is something you wont do and you feel the sport tires will not grip enough then this group of hypersports will be where you might be.

NONE of them last on the track, sadly I do not find many customers who can get many days out of them, think of them more as a qualifying tire in that the compounds are so soft because they are street tires and they assume no warm up they sacrifice durability to give very good levels of traction with little fuss. On the street these same tires can be made to go thousands of miles but street riding is not track riding.

I would expect the rosso corsa would get you the 3 days you are looking for I have put a couple sets on MV Agusta F3-800's that have more power than the 916 and have made it through 6-7 days with a middle group instructor riding the bike. I have been on a set of the rosso corsa's myself on my 750ss which has less power than the 916 and got about 11-12 days instructing and playing. Tire pressure was important because at lower pressures the rear got slippery, with more pressure they stuck like glue.

The Race tires in a medium or durable compound should get you MORE life than the hypersport tires but will require you to keep a much closer eye on pressures and either run tire warmers or warm the tires before riding hard. I have also been on Michelin power cup evo tires and they have been great but are also race tires with all of the race tire traits such as worrying about hot/cold tear and warm up.

There is another in the pirelli lineup you might look at and that is the trackday slick, I have a few customers who have run this tire and have gotten good life out of it and it has been cheaper than the supercorsa spv2.

That brings up cost. The hypersport tires are not cheap and with them wearing as fast as they do you might find race tires are only slightly more money and give you more life than a hypersport tire.
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post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 15th, 2016, 10:24 am Thread Starter
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Thanks for that very detailed reply. I have tire warmers and keep a very close eye on pressures. I would also consider myself to be be a very smooth rider. Lap times are not my thing. Big lean angles and perfect smooth lines row my boat. So far I have three tires I'm considering, all in the Pirelli range. Best life will come from the Super bike pro. The only down side to this tire from what I've read is that it takes a lot of warming before you can push. With my tire warmers I don't see that being a problem.I'm also considering the straight Superbike version of this tire. That's gonna be super sticky and also require a lot of heat to get the best of. The question with this tire will be
durability. Then last but not least is the Rosso Corsa.

I think I'm gonna do a little more research on the two tire choices in the Pirelli Superbike range and see how we go..
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post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 15th, 2016, 2:05 pm
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The pirelli trackday slick will last a very long time but has little grip.
If you use warmers you should try the stickier race tires and change them when you need too. You will ride faster,safer, and have more fun. Of course it will cost more.
I said try them, that is the best way to make the best decision. Tires at the track have so many variables, there is no way you can get the best answer from others, even with alot of experience.
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post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 15th, 2016, 7:36 pm
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If you are considering the race tires or even the hypersports and have warmers to use with them the solution would be extra wheels and switch them when you become uncomfortable with the wear on the second day. I've been running Q3s on my 900SS racebike and I have a ball with them. They slide predictably when provoked and more importantly they come back without drama. I generally can get about 4 days out of them and they are still pretty good when at and below the wear bars. Plus you can't beat the price.
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post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 16th, 2016, 3:17 am Thread Starter
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Been doing a load of reasearch and the more I read the more indecisive I become. All of the reviews of the Superbike PRO say it has reduced grip in favour of tire life however I think this reduced grip needs to be quantified. Obviously it's not gonna be as sticky as a full on racing slick but surely it has to be better than a Hypersport tire?

If it had the same consistent grip of say, a Rosso Corsa for example that would be more than enough grip for 80-90% of the track junkies. I have read it's not as good as a super Corsa but again this has to be quantified. A super Corsa sp/sc is only exceptional for the first ten laps. After that it starts to degrade and will only last a day and a half at best.

The problem with the Rosso Corsa is its not a track tire and can get greasy if pushed. That won't happen with the PRO. From what I've read it'll just keep the same consistent performance lap after lap. I now just need to understand how it compares to a Rosso Corsa for grip and feel. If anyone has any experience using both that would be great.
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post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 2016, 9:16 am
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Unless you are pretty darn fast, you really should give the Q3's a try. Excellent track day tire, great price, very predictable. Ive enjoyed them on track days.....

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post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 2016, 10:42 am
 
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When I was doing track days on my 97' 916, I used the Pirelli Supercorsa Pro's. This was about 8 years ago, so I am not sure if they are the same as today. I got to be quite a track junky at this time in my life and would do about 10 track days a year, mostly at Thunderhill raceway in Northern Cal. I would just make the time cutoff to run in the A group.

I loved the tires as they had much more grip than any street tire I had used at the time. Also getting the suspension set up properly was huge in getting the tires to last. At first I was getting alot of tearing of the rear tire, but after conferring with an suspension expert, was able the bike set up properly to get the most out of the tires.

What I liked about the tires was their feel and grip and how they would gradually drift rather than just let go. This would happen almost like clockwork on the third day of use at around 1:00 in the afternoon on a particular turn. I would then back off just a bit for the rest of the day. I would then buy another set for the next 3 sessions.

In the 3500 track day miles I did with these tires, I thankfully never crashed. Scared myself a few times. But the tires were amazing and instilled the confidence to ride at my limit.

Mike
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post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 2016, 10:43 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thumper580 View Post
Unless you are pretty darn fast, you really should give the Q3's a try. Excellent track day tire, great price, very predictable. Ive enjoyed them on track days.....
I have read the same thing many times about the Q3's. I run the Pirelli Superbike slick on my 1098S, but I have a friend on a R6 that runs the Q3's and he puts down the same times as me and has a lot more $ in his wallet.
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post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 2016, 10:59 am
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I run track days on a billiard table smooth track in a very hot climate with an under-powered old antique; my strategy is to work on smooth transitions from deep lean angles to full power exits. The Q3's have been excellent for this, three days is all I get out of the rear tire although on the hottest days it starts to get greasy on the edges, with predictable recoveries, after 20 minutes into each session. Need to watch the tire pressure closely, but have yet to feel the front tire is going to let me down although it does slide nicely.

As said above by others, so many variables are at work in tire choice that you really can't take much advice from other riders experiences. So, I recommend at least trying a set of the Q3's because they are a relatively inexpensive option that many people praise.

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Last edited by RockAZ; Oct 17th, 2016 at 11:19 am.
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