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Tamaren Jan 24th, 2019 1:11 pm

Antigravity batteries
 
1 Attachment(s)
Looking to run the AG-1201 in my 900SSD. I've run antigravity batteries before and they are an excellent product, but my only concern is they don't like unregulated voltage spikes. I was planning on testing the bike on a spare battery just to double check, but are the bevels prone to weird voltages? I can't have anything too high, and I can't exceed a charge rate of 12 Amps.

All the other specs are well within what I'm looking for, 360 CCA, exc.

Anybody running Lithium batteries on an electric start '80?

Pic for attention.

Thanks,
Wesley

Duccout Jan 24th, 2019 11:20 pm

I doubt that they are the same (??) but I've been running a tiny Odyssey battery on my 900 for years with no problems. It sure saves a lot of weight!

Ventodue Jan 26th, 2019 3:32 am

Hi Wesley,

Like Colin, I still use regular AGM batteries in my bikes, my SSD included. Quality AGMs push out the CCA you need and you should expect 8+ years of life. I can't really see the advantage of Lithiums: they're more expensive, are reputed to be fussy about how they're charged - and the weight saving sure ain't gonna make no difference!

That said, I know at least one Laverda owner who's running a Lithium in his late 1990's bike. He seems happy :-))

But back to your questions: voltage spikes. Well, not so much 'spikes'; but the standard reg/rec in these bikes is a fairly simple bridge rectifier and shunt regulator and yes, you can see voltage at the battery going up to 14v or so. A more modern Mosfet would deal with this - but it's yet more expense to deal with a problem that you've caused in the first place. So ...

As to the charge current. In theory, the alternator can put out 200 watts at a rectified 12v. Which in theory could push the current above 16 amps. In practice? Not so sure ... :-)

HTH

Craig

Tamaren Apr 27th, 2019 3:07 pm

Appriciate the advice, and in the future to save some money an AGM would be what I would go with, but if anyone is wondering I've run that lithium battery on my '80 SSD with no problems for a few months. Been reliable and no issues starting. It's an option for people out there, I guess.

Ventodue Apr 28th, 2019 5:54 am

Thanks for the feed-back, Wesley. As you say, gives another option ...

Craig

chad-ANTIGRAVITYLITHIUMBATTERIES Apr 30th, 2019 10:43 am

Hi everyone, just wanted to chime in here to add a little additional info as we just came back recently as site sponsors.

Essentially the concern with charging here is that a lot of bikes from the mid 80's and older were using old style mechanical voltage regulators. Sure you can test your output but if it's randomly failing, sticking and spiking voltage (which at some point after time it will) you may not catch it. Keep in mind this is also harmful to lead/acid batteries but just not as detrimental as it can be to lithium. So the safe solution here is just updating to modern solid state components that will work in proper tolerance.

While one of the key benefits is weight with lithium batteries it's not always going to make a spectacular difference, especially in heavier bikes but there are other benefits such as physical size, peak performance output, having twice the cranking power, and a longer lifespan when maintained properly. While Tamaran was looking at the AG-1201 which doesn't have any additional protections built in and maintaining becomes extremely vital, it should also be noted that there are options available as well like our RE-START series which have protections built in to help ensure that battery is maintained.

As I mentioned we recently just signed on as sponsors so please feel free to reach out to us with any questions you might have on lithium or any of our products.

Ventodue May 2nd, 2019 3:19 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by chad-ANTIGRAVITYLITHIUMBATTERIES (Post 6981789)
Essentially the concern with charging here is that a lot of bikes from the mid 80's and older were using old style mechanical voltage regulators.

Thanks for the comments, Chad. Just so you know, I think you'll find that the regulators on these bikes use SCR diodes to do the shunting, i.e. they're not mechanical.

Not that makes the voltage regulation ever so reliable ! :-)

Old rider May 2nd, 2019 4:14 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by chad-ANTIGRAVITYLITHIUMBATTERIES (Post 6981789)
Hi everyone, just wanted to chime in here to add a little additional info as we just came back recently as site sponsors.

Essentially the concern with charging here is that a lot of bikes from the mid 80's and older were using old style mechanical voltage regulators. Sure you can test your output but if it's randomly failing, sticking and spiking voltage (which at some point after time it will) you may not catch it. Keep in mind this is also harmful to lead/acid batteries but just not as detrimental as it can be to lithium. So the safe solution here is just updating to modern solid state components that will work in proper tolerance.

While one of the key benefits is weight with lithium batteries it's not always going to make a spectacular difference, especially in heavier bikes but there are other benefits such as physical size, peak performance output, having twice the cranking power, and a longer lifespan when maintained properly. While Tamaran was looking at the AG-1201 which doesn't have any additional protections built in and maintaining becomes extremely vital, it should also be noted that there are options available as well like our RE-START series which have protections built in to help ensure that battery is maintained.

As I mentioned we recently just signed on as sponsors so please feel free to reach out to us with any questions you might have on lithium or any of our products.

It would be good to know what the protections are that built into the ReStart batteries.
Lithium batteries are definitely the future but most of us have been holding fire on them until such time as they are as reliable and safe to install in an older machine as lead acid. If your ReStart batteries have indeed reached that stage, then you could be getting a flood of orders...

chad-ANTIGRAVITYLITHIUMBATTERIES May 2nd, 2019 9:24 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old rider (Post 6982383)
It would be good to know what the protections are that built into the ReStart batteries.
Lithium batteries are definitely the future but most of us have been holding fire on them until such time as they are as reliable and safe to install in an older machine as lead acid. If your ReStart batteries have indeed reached that stage, then you could be getting a flood of orders...

So the quick summary is that you have over discharge, over charge, as well as thermal protections built in. To elaborate a little, the BMS(Battery management system) built into the battery will put it into a sleep mode if any of these conditions outside of normal operating parameters exist. For example, let's say you leave an accessory running, key in the ignition or something that would typically be causing the battery to get drained and eventually over discharged, The battery shuts itself off to prevent this from happening and at the same time does it at a point where you still have enough reserve to be able to stat the bike at least a few times at the touch of a button.

For those interested check out the vendor thread for the special on Ducati batteries going on right now.

https://www.ducati.ms/forums/641-ant...-shipping.html

Old rider May 2nd, 2019 5:48 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by chad-ANTIGRAVITYLITHIUMBATTERIES (Post 6982431)
So the quick summary is that you have over discharge, over charge, as well as thermal protections built in. To elaborate a little, the BMS(Battery management system) built into the battery will put it into a sleep mode if any of these conditions outside of normal operating parameters exist. For example, let's say you leave an accessory running, key in the ignition or something that would typically be causing the battery to get drained and eventually over discharged, The battery shuts itself off to prevent this from happening and at the same time does it at a point where you still have enough reserve to be able to stat the bike at least a few times at the touch of a button.

For those interested check out the vendor thread for the special on Ducati batteries going on right now.

https://www.ducati.ms/forums/641-ant...-shipping.html

Personally. I'd be very happy to hear a full explanation rather than a quick summary. It's the potential for fire that worries most people rather than the possibility of the battery dying. If the battery or reg/rec catches fire, we potentially lose the whole bike.


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