Dare I ask about oil? - Page 3 - Ducati.ms - The Ultimate Ducati Forum
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post #21 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 1:36 pm
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I have preferred either Mobil 1 synthetic or Quaker state in my cars depending on how new the cars were. Last oil change on my Ducati 900SS I thought I would give this one a try. It seems fine to me, what do you guys think?

Mobil 1 V‐Twin 20W‐50 specs are 1600 PPM Phosphorus, 1750 PPM Zinc

1991 900SS
1995 900SS SP #746
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post #22 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 2:26 pm Thread Starter
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Thanks for all your input guys. Both the 998 and the HM will be getting a colonic this weekend.
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post #23 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 3:09 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckMan View Post
That's interesting. Here in the States that oil only exists in a 10w-40.

But yes, use it.
Afaik it is the same as the Mobil 1 v-twin oil. Just a new name as people did think that it was a Harley oil.


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post #24 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 3:55 pm
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"the fact is that the engineers who specify the nominal operating environment selected 300-V because it met their needs."

First of all I am not a cynic but a realist who has worked in engineering all of my life.
Please do not think that any engineer will specify any particular brand of oil, it is the accountants that do that. The engineer will specify the viscosity and minimum rating (API or Euro ACEA spec). The additive package will be part of the oil which determines that specification.
You will be lucky to hear of any engine failure due to a bad oil over the last 15 years or so, they are all good.
Motul may be this months flavour but my 2010 848 has a sticker on the engine telling me to use Shell. I am very happy with my 5W40 API SG full synthetic that I use. I will not tell you the maker of that oil as it does not matter as long as it meets the specs and viscosity required. I would never use anything with a 20 at the front of the number as it puts so much strain on the lubrication system while taking longer to lubricate the engine on start up.
At the end of the day use what you want, it is your engine, but there is no such thing as a bad oil that meets the specs.
V-Twin oil is a great marketing laugh! When the oil is stopping two bits of metal from rubbing together, does it know how many cylinders the engine has? Does it care? Will they start marketing oil for red bike and white bikes next?
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post #25 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 4:36 pm
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Oil is an exciting topic on forums, that is for sure! I very much agree that any synthetic oil made in the last 15 years is all excellent stuff, go by the rating required to pick your flavor.

Anyway, I live in hot climate, often hits 45 degrees Celsius everyday for a hundred days a year - 20W oil works pretty well here. Never had the occasion to start a motorcycle when it was below 10 degrees Celsius ever. As an engineer I wonder what would you say of the - relative to other available brands - high phosphorus and zinc content of the Mobile 1 V-Twin oil (for RED BIKES! ) in an older motor with over 30,000 miles that has flat tappets vs rollers?

1991 900SS
1995 900SS SP #746

Last edited by RockAZ; Oct 12th, 2015 at 4:42 pm.
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post #26 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 5:00 pm
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Its Italian, so..... Olive Oil should work just fine

When in doubt, lean more...
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post #27 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 5:03 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob T View Post
...First of all I am not a cynic but a realist who has worked in engineering all of my life. Please do not think that any engineer will specify any particular brand of oil, it is the accountants that do that. The engineer will specify the viscosity and minimum rating (API or Euro ACEA spec)...
I am also a mechanical engineer, and have been for my entire professional career, beginning with R&D design/engineering of attack submarine combat systems for 12 years when I first got out of school and working for the a design engineering software company for the last 22. If the wording of my response led you to the conclusion that it was my belief that the engineers at Ducati specifically requested Motul 300-V, and re-reading what I wrote I can see how you would get that impression, then my apologies as that was not my intent. However, they did design around the specifications of a lubricant whose requirements were met by Motul, and most likely several others as well. My point was that it met their requirements and they endorsed it, and that is good enough for me.

The "cynic" comment was with regards to your view that all of these companies exist solely to profit. I feel it is a bit cynical to make that sort of assumption and I disagree with that view. Every organization I ever belonged to, and every design I ever initiated or participated in was intended first and foremost to solve a problem, or to create something that had never been created. I worked for and with people that inspired me, and do to this day. That was why I became an engineer in the first place... money had nothing to do with it. Personal satisfaction did.

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post #28 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 5:44 pm
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My 748 was run on Motul all it's life until it died at 29,000 miles with worn out big ends and crank journals.
I won't be using it again, it's a race formulation oil and not suited to longer road bike change intervals.
Even on the oil pressure gauge I could see it degrade and drop pressure in as little as 800 km of hard use due to shear as the gearbox chopped it's long chain molecules up.
The Penrite I use now doesn't suffer the same issue.
Yer pay's yer money and takes yer pick but it pays to do plenty research and do your own assesments in life whatever the subject.
Oils ain't oils.

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post #29 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 5:48 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Black View Post
You only need the zinc and phosphorous when normal lubrication has failed and then you are probably screwed anyway,Also there is a good argument for using as little in the way of additives as possible so there is more oil to do the lubricating. Plenty cars use the same engine oil as gearbox oil. There is such a thing as progress and the additives are also constantly evolving. You don't think they took the zinc and phosphorous out and didn't put something else in?

Damn! Now look what I've gone and done!

Most engine wear occurs at cold startup and that's just one time the additives are of value and if the additives work long after normal lubrication has failed what does that tell you about oils that have them and oils that don't.
They don't make 4T oils with them for just for the fun of printing it on the label.

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post #30 of 42 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 2015, 6:19 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davy.j View Post
I won't be using it again, it's a race formulation oil and not suited to longer road bike change intervals.
Even on the oil pressure gauge I could see it degrade and drop pressure in as little as 800 km of hard use due to shear as the gearbox chopped it's long chain molecules up.
As davy.j points out above, any oil used in a shared sump motorcycle engine tends to thin out/loose viscosity) over time. The EPA has pressured engine manufacturers to extend oil change intervals to reduce the disposal problem of used motor oil. But therein lies a problem. Tests have shown that oil that also lubricates the gearbox in a motorcycle looses viscosity quite quickly. The gears in the transmission are the significant factor in cutting the longer oil molecules into shorter pieces that are less viscous.

In one series of tests, non-synthetic motorcycle-specific oils had lost over 30% of their viscosity at 800 miles, and over 35% at 1,500 miles.

It should be noted that the viscosity of synthetic-based oils generally drops more slowly than that of petroleum-based oils in the same engine. Also, starting out with a 50 weight oil means that it takes longer to end up with a 20 weight oil, for example.

This doesn't speak well for 7,500 mile oil change intervals (also encouraged by the EPA).

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