2017 MTS Airbox upgrade available for 15/16? - Page 5 - Ducati.ms - The Ultimate Ducati Forum
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post #41 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 8th, 2017, 12:00 am
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Originally Posted by fubar929 View Post
Because, at least in the U.S., DOT and CARB don't let you make random modifications to vehicles that will be used on public roads? California in particular has become very strict on aftermarket exhausts, ECU tuning, etc.


But since there's zero difference between the '15s, '16s and '17s it's hardly a 'random' change. Hell, if things were that tough, none of us would ever have gotten new maps at all.

I don't recall European dyno charts looking any better than the US ones, and as 767 posted, there is no such singular thing as 'US gas'. We've seen charts from US owners using E10 as well as the undiluted stuff and they look the same.

The US gas thing is just a smokescreen. What they should have said is "this is what we had to do to pass Euro 4 testing". However that testing formula works, it's clear that the test is run in somewhere in the 5 to 6k rpm range. So they run lean there and do whatever other tricks they have up their sleeves, and they pass.

Look at what they had to do to the 821 motor to get it to pass Euro 4. Just to stay on par, power-wise, now it's a 939!

Last edited by porkrind; Jan 8th, 2017 at 12:13 am.
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post #42 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 8th, 2017, 7:01 pm
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But since there's zero difference between the '15s, '16s and '17s it's hardly a 'random' change. Hell, if things were that tough, none of us would ever have gotten new maps at all.
How long did it take to get those new maps? 9 months? 12? Despite 2015 owners immediate complaints and bad press from Cycle World, the 2016 bike I bought in October of 2015 still had the same problems. An updated map wasn't available until mid- to late-November as I recall. Last time I checked it doesn't take a year's worth of dyno time to produce an ECU map. I don't know for a fact that an inefficient meddling bureaucracy like DOT or CARB was involved in the process... but let's just say that it wouldn't surprise me.

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What they should have said is "this is what we had to do to pass Euro 4 testing".
What they should have done is produced a more reasonable map from the start. They could have, for example, realized that nobody in the U.S. cares about Euro 4 compliance and introduced the bike with a map optimized for U.S. regulations...
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post #43 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 9th, 2017, 8:04 pm
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Originally Posted by Bonaventure View Post
As DaveK cited, not an unconfirmed rumor. The original thread w/ mention of the Ducati USA National Service Manager's statement regarding a Campaign coming out on it is here:

DVT Air box upgrade owner notification

At this point, do I expect Ducati to foot the cost of an all inclusive recall campaign to do this? No. But how about some kind of Sponsored Path for '15 and '16 owners who so choose, to be able to upgrade their bikes for no cost or wholesale cost?
They did comp most of the gas tank expansion recall on sport classics.

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post #44 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 10th, 2017, 8:56 am
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I spoke to a Ducati rep at the IMS show in DC last weekend. He wasn't aware of any change to the air box, and said that even if there was, the upgrade would probably not be free.

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post #45 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 10th, 2017, 1:04 pm
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They did comp most of the gas tank expansion recall on sport classics.
Sorry to say but I have a Sportclassic and that whole process was such a debacle and handled so poorly I ended up buying a hand made aluminum tank out of pocket and washed my hands of the situation. They may have comped me a few tanks but they never actually fixed the underlying issue either and each of those comped tanks failed within a year. That's unfortunately a poor example to use if you were trying to show good will on their part.

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post #46 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 10th, 2017, 5:10 pm
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Sorry to say but I have a Sportclassic and that whole process was such a debacle and handled so poorly I ended up buying a hand made aluminum tank out of pocket and washed my hands of the situation. They may have comped me a few tanks but they never actually fixed the underlying issue either and each of those comped tanks failed within a year. That's unfortunately a poor example to use if you were trying to show good will on their part.
I will say Ducati did the same thing to me and my old 1198. I bought it back in 2009 and went through 3 tanks. Such a pain and each tank was supposedly "fixed" and would not expand.

Thank god my 1199 is aluminum and I hate that my DVT has the plastic tank. Though my dealer assured me it was also "fixed". Haha, not that I believe that for a min.
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post #47 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 2017, 2:07 am
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Originally Posted by Fearless View Post
I spoke to a Ducati rep at the IMS show in DC last weekend. He wasn't aware of any change to the air box, and said that even if there was, the upgrade would probably not be free.
Same news from my dealer here in Spain. Any notify from Ducati. He think it would not be free and does not know if the Remap could be available for 15' & 16' MTS
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post #48 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 2017, 2:15 pm
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I wonder how much of the 2017's [supposedly] better mid range torque is actually due to the air box or more likely, just the new ECU map. Makes me think they may have finally solved it in software and the design change to the airbox may be secondary.

If the airbox was any kind of bottle neck or choke point in the first place it seems like '15 and '16 owners could resolve that by simply replacing the stock paper air filter with a BMC filter with a higher CFM rating, thus compensating for whatever shortcoming the '15 and '16 airbox was found to have that necessitated the design update for 2017.

If my theory in paragraph one is the case, then there's no reason why a map update couldn't released '15 and '16 DVT's unless the new airbox itself is somehow increasing CFM air flow or doing something related to laminar flow to the throttle bodies.
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post #49 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 2017, 10:21 pm
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Originally Posted by Bonaventure View Post
I wonder how much of the 2017's [supposedly] better mid range torque is actually due to the air box or more likely, just the new ECU map. Makes me think they may have finally solved it in software and the design change to the airbox may be secondary.
If the airbox were too restrictive, you'd think that would cause top-end performance to suffer. The fact that the bike has a pronounced flat spot around 5K RPMs, but not above or below, sure seems like a software issue. Coincidentally, this also feels like the sort of RPM range where one or more government agencies might be doing emissions or noise testing...
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post #50 of 61 (permalink) Old Jan 15th, 2017, 7:40 am
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I have recently ordered and installed the only truly different air box parts for 2017 onto a 2015 to aid with protection against dirt. The new cover has a bit of a snorkel and a different filter as well as a compression ring to hold the filter against the air box more firmly. I can see many benefits to this design for folks riding dirt on the multi but with regards to the performance I'm under the impression that is mostly mapping changes for the new model year.

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