Cold start issue resolved on 696

[metroplex]

Ever since I got the 696 brand new from the dealership with 0 miles, it has had difficulty starting below 45-50F ambient. The Yuasa battery was brand new and it has lived on a Tender since I first got the bike. Looking on the Internet, it seems may other 696 owners have the same problem. Most of the common replies consist of "use the fast idle lever, follow the owner's manual, blah blah blah" and some nicer folks looked at Li-Ion batteries, wiring upgrades, considered leaner/richer tunes, or suggested that the engine break in more.

I changed the oil, changed to Iridium spark plugs, deleted the evap canister, upgraded the spark plug wires, checked the battery wiring connections, etc... and the 696 still had issues cold starting. I noticed the spark plugs were always oily, and a lot of oil residue collected on the tailpipes. Revving the engine would always result in a puff of blue smoke upon deceleration. What I noticed more was that during the difficult cold starts, after 36-40 cranks when the engine finally starts, there would always be a plume of blue smoke coming out. And yes, I understand the difference between blue smoke (oil being burned), black smoke (rich condition), and steam.

So I looked at my oil level (after the change), and wow, it was really overfilled. I didn't realize it was that important to have the bike vertical and off the stands. This requires some Yoga skills with a block of wood on the sidestand.

After I drained out the excess and kept the oil level at or slightly above the minimum/lower mark on the sightglass, the cold start issues went away.

I conducted 4 cold start tests, one a day essentially, with the ambient air/outdoor temperatures at 35, 37, 28, and 17 degrees F respectively.

For the first 2 tests, I waited until the headlight shut off, kept the Tender on, and waited until the battery voltage was at 12.8 VDC or as high as it can go on the Tender. I opened up the fast idle lever, and hit the starter. In one crank, the engine fired up, hobbled around 1k RPM, and then sped up by itself. Only once did it stall out, but it fired up on the next start.

I still needed to rule out the battery/voltage, so today when the outside temp was 17F and the engine was actually 28F (using IR thermometer inside the unheated garage), I pulled the TEnder, turned on the key, opened the lever, and hit the starter without waiting. I saw the battery voltage was at 12.3 VDC during cranking. It fired right up, hobbled around 1-1.5k RPM, and sped up by itself.

Although that is only 4 test trials, I think the oil level was the biggest cause of cold starting issues. I recall that from the factory/dealer, my oil level was close to the top mark and could have been overfilled. I see from Ducati promotional photographs that the oil level is always at or slightly above that min mark on the sight glass.

I wonder how the oil level relates to ambient air temperature, and my only guess is that at colder temperatures, oil soaked spark plugs and 2 cold combustion chambers with "high" compression makes it harder to start than say a 4/6/8/10/12 cylinder engine with more spark plugs/cylinders.

From what others have said, it doesn't take much to go over the top mark, so it might be worthwhile to check your oil level if you have issues cold starting a Monster 696.

I've ruled out the headlight, spark plugs, spark plug wires, oil viscosity/type, battery, battery/starter wiring, DP Race ECU stock tune, and other voodoo.

My 696 has the DP race ECU (non-ABS), Termi's, DP race filter, 93 octane from the local pump, Denso IXU24 iridium plugs (at 0.9mm gap), Magnecor 8.5mm race wires, synthetic engine oil, and K&N oil filter - if that matters at all since I still had cold start problems with all this stuff until I drained the excess oil.

[oleary]

Originally Posted by metroplex

Ever since I got the 696 brand new from the dealership with 0 miles, it has had difficulty starting below 45-50F ambient. The Yuasa battery was brand new and it has lived on a Tender since I first got the bike. Looking on the Internet, it seems may other 696 owners have the same problem. Most of the common replies consist of "use the fast idle lever, follow the owner's manual, blah blah blah" and some nicer folks looked at Li-Ion batteries, wiring upgrades, considered leaner/richer tunes, or suggested that the engine break in more.

I changed the oil, changed to Iridium spark plugs, deleted the evap canister, upgraded the spark plug wires, checked the battery wiring connections, etc... and the 696 still had issues cold starting. I noticed the spark plugs were always oily, and a lot of oil residue collected on the tailpipes. Revving the engine would always result in a puff of blue smoke upon deceleration. What I noticed more was that during the difficult cold starts, after 36-40 cranks when the engine finally starts, there would always be a plume of blue smoke coming out. And yes, I understand the difference between blue smoke (oil being burned), black smoke (rich condition), and steam.

So I looked at my oil level (after the change), and wow, it was really overfilled. I didn't realize it was that important to have the bike vertical and off the stands. This requires some Yoga skills with a block of wood on the sidestand.

After I drained out the excess and kept the oil level at or slightly above the minimum/lower mark on the sightglass, the cold start issues went away.

I conducted 4 cold start tests, one a day essentially, with the ambient air/outdoor temperatures at 35, 37, 28, and 17 degrees F respectively.

For the first 2 tests, I waited until the headlight shut off, kept the Tender on, and waited until the battery voltage was at 12.8 VDC or as high as it can go on the Tender. I opened up the fast idle lever, and hit the starter. In one crank, the engine fired up, hobbled around 1k RPM, and then sped up by itself. Only once did it stall out, but it fired up on the next start.

I still needed to rule out the battery/voltage, so today when the outside temp was 17F and the engine was actually 28F (using IR thermometer inside the unheated garage), I pulled the TEnder, turned on the key, opened the lever, and hit the starter without waiting. I saw the battery voltage was at 12.3 VDC during cranking. It fired right up, hobbled around 1-1.5k RPM, and sped up by itself.

Although that is only 4 test trials, I think the oil level was the biggest cause of cold starting issues. I recall that from the factory/dealer, my oil level was close to the top mark and could have been overfilled. I see from Ducati promotional photographs that the oil level is always at or slightly above that min mark on the sight glass.

I wonder how the oil level relates to ambient air temperature, and my only guess is that at colder temperatures, oil soaked spark plugs and 2 cold combustion chambers with "high" compression makes it harder to start than say a 4/6/8/10/12 cylinder engine with more spark plugs/cylinders.

From what others have said, it doesn't take much to go over the top mark, so it might be worthwhile to check your oil level if you have issues cold starting a Monster 696.

I've ruled out the headlight, spark plugs, spark plug wires, oil viscosity/type, battery, battery/starter wiring, DP Race ECU stock tune, and other voodoo.

My 696 has the DP race ECU (non-ABS), Termi's, DP race filter, 93 octane from the local pump, Denso IXU24 iridium plugs (at 0.9mm gap), Magnecor 8.5mm race wires, synthetic engine oil, and K&N oil filter - if that matters at all since I still had cold start problems with all this stuff until I drained the excess oil.

Your experience kind of confirms my comments in this Blue exhaust smoke upon startup? thread.

[metroplex]

Yep! But the cold start issue existed before I touched the oil. Like I mention, it must have come from the dealer/factory overfilled. But it was within the sight glass marks but closer to the top mark from what I recall. I looked at my Ducati Story 5th Edition book and the photo of a S4R showed the sightglass with the oil level at the lower mark. I also found Ducati photographs of the 696 and 848 Streetfighter with similar oil levels.

[oleary]

Originally Posted by metroplex

Yep! But the cold start issue existed before I touched the oil. Like I mention, it must have come from the dealer/factory overfilled. But it was within the sight glass marks but closer to the top mark from what I recall. I looked at my Ducati Story 5th Edition book and the photo of a S4R showed the sightglass with the oil level at the lower mark. I also found Ducati photographs of the 696 and 848 Streetfighter with similar oil levels.

From my experience, if it was within the sight glass marks with the bike exactly vertical you should be OK, but I understood from your earlier comments that the bike was 1 quart overfilled at some point. The effects of that issue need to be resolved.

[metroplex]

I just wanted to provide an update. I performed cold starts on an intermittent basis, trying to conduct it as cold as possible. I waited a week between starts for the most recent trial run, and it still fired right up. It was 10F in the morning, and warmed up to 18F ambient. My LCD read 22F. I yanked the Tender for a few minutes, opened the fast idle lever, and fired up the engine with 1 push of the button. I'm using 93 octane fuel too.

[oleary]

Originally Posted by metroplex

I just wanted to provide an update. I performed cold starts on an intermittent basis, trying to conduct it as cold as possible. I waited a week between starts for the most recent trial run, and it still fired right up. It was 10F in the morning, and warmed up to 18F ambient. My LCD read 22F. I yanked the Tender for a few minutes, opened the fast idle lever, and fired up the engine with 1 push of the button. I'm using 93 octane fuel too.

I'm glad it worked out OK.

If I have learned anything in almost 50 years of messing with machinery it's this:

(1) Look for the simple shit first; and,
(2) If it was working OK before I started buggering with it, and it ain't working now, ... then?

[metroplex]

Originally Posted by oleary

I'm glad it worked out OK.

If I have learned anything in almost 50 years of messing with machinery it's this:

(1) Look for the simple shit first; and,
(2) If it was working OK before I started buggering with it, and it ain't working now, ... then?

Yeah, but it didn't work right when it came from the dealer/factory. They must have overfilled the oil by a certain amount. I didn't spend as much time diagnosing the problem since everyone told me that it was because the engine had to be broken in and should be fine after the first 600 mile maintenance. This winter, I was determined to make my 696 start up like any other modern fuel injected engine.

[oleary]

Originally Posted by metroplex

Yeah, but it didn't work right when it came from the dealer/factory. They must have overfilled the oil by a certain amount. I didn't spend as much time diagnosing the problem since everyone told me that it was because the engine had to be broken in and should be fine after the first 600 mile maintenance. This winter, I was determined to make my 696 start up like any other modern fuel injected engine.

" .... since everyone told me ... ".

I forgot that one. That's Rule #3 - Don't listen to "everyone".

And good on ya for seeing it through. That's Rule #4 - Always persevere.