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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 12:52 am   #1 (permalink)
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Tried to buy a SF 848 (story of buyer beware)....

The wife is ready for a new bike so we decided that the SF 848 might be a good fit. I knew that Ace Motorsports in Concord had a demo unit with 1,200 miles and Termi's on it so we went by there to have her take a look at it. We got the usual info on the bike, mileage, warranty, etc and also asked about the stock exhaust. The salesman said that it had been discarded (huh??) and told us how crazy it was that the guy in the back had just thrown it away. Anyway, she really liked the bike and we decided to come back the next day so she could ride it. It's a demo, yes. But we figured we'd get a good deal on it and still get a bike with the Termi's and full factory warranty.

So we went to the dealer the next day to have her test ride the bike. Since she has a monster 696 now, she was also going to test ride a Monster 1100 EVO, the other bike she liked. She test rode the 2 and decided that she definitely wanted the SF. Great!! With that decision out of the way it was time to talk numbers.

Before I go any further, let me back-track for just a moment to earlier that day when we were at home and Stephanie remembered something. A few months back we were at this same dealer and one of the guys told us that their FedEx driver had backed into a bike and knocked it over earlier that same day. She figured, just in case, let's ask to make sure this wasn't THAT bike. So fast-forward to when we were starting to talk numbers with the salesman, who the previous day had told us about the exhaust being discarded. Well, turns out he never told us the entire story on WHY it was discarded. This WAS the bike that had been knocked over. We asked about it and at that point he had to tell us that yes it was THAT bike. Worst part is that we continued to talk numbers with them and they literally started the numbers off at full MSRP. the salesman kept saying that they had to start there, to which I replied that that was fine, as long as he'd continue by saying ".....from that, since its a demo, we will subtract $______.......". That never happened. They wanted to charge full price for the Termi's, which were anything but new AND they wanted to charge labor for installing the exhaust (plus the tax on it) that they HAD to replace due to the damage. That's why they threw away the stock exhaust. They also were still charging the Destination and setup charges, which totaled +/- $1,300. Long story short, their OTD price for the bike was about $17,400!!. This basically equates to about $900 off of a demo bike with 1,200 miles, needed some TLC since it sits in the sun all day AND had been knocked over by a truck and had to be repaired. Not to mention they probably got insurance money either from their insurance or FedEx's. I seriously doubt they just said "don't worry about it, we got this".

In the end it actually worked out. I wanted to get the bike for Stephanie so she could have it for Xmas, but it would have had to be a really good deal to be able to make sense of any or all of the shortcomings I just mentioned.

I'm not writing this to rain on anyone's parade. This isn't about sour grapes. Like i said, In the end they did us a favor because we ended up finding what I think is a very good deal ( will elaborate on that in a moment) on a bike she'll be much happier with. I'm writing this because had we not known about what happened to that bike....had we not, by chance, been there at the dealer the day the bike was knocked over by a truck, we would never have asked about it and the dealer certainly would never have told us about it. That was 100% evidenced by the question we asked the day before (about the exhaust) and the salesman's answer to our question about it the very next day. I'm writing this so hopefully, if someone sees this bike, they'll know what they're really getting and pay what they should pay for it. In other words, I'll disclose here what they didn't originally disclose to us.

Anyway, that same night we found a streetfighter online that looked great. It had 1,200 miles, private (original) owner, garage kept, like new with 18 months of warranty left and the first service already done...for $10,900. It even had a new rear tire after the owner got a nail in the original one. The bike also has the DP comfort seat and the Ducati rear tail bag. The owner, who is 50+ years old, has two other bikes and had this for about 5 or 6 months before realizing he didn't really need it. Even after we buy the exhaust, pay for shipping from TN, pay all the taxes and reg fees, (total "OTD") we'll STILL will have saved +/- $3,400. We bought it and are now just waiting for it to be shipped to us.

I also want to add that I have had good experiences here at this dealer as far as service goes. The guys there have always taken good care of me. But honestly, this bothered me and I figured I'd at least post something here to hopefully help someone out.


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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 1:22 am   #2 (permalink)
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Not honesty at its best. Sometimes dealers suffer due to honesty, but that is better than getting a rep as one who tries to pull the wool over a customer's eyes.
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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 1:26 am   #3 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Mad Dog View Post
Not honesty at its best. Sometimes dealers suffer due to honesty, but that is better than getting a rep as one who tries to pull the wool over a customer's eyes.
Especially when you consider that they must have gotten money to repair the bike. So in actuality they are trying to make money on the bike twice!!


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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 4:49 am   #4 (permalink)
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They'll find a sucker eventually, that's the reason why they're in business.
Good luck with the new bike!
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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 7:16 am   #5 (permalink)
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I think what that dealer tried to do might be illegal. I know for a fact that if that bike was brand new. And it got knocked over by a truck and they fixed it and then sold it while not disclosing the tip over. That would be against the new vehicle rules and laws in most states. Technically, if a new car gets a small dent while on the lot it cannot be fixed or repaired and sold as new. That's why hail sales happen. I'm not sure if this applies to demo bikes though. That dealer is shady and I wouldn't buy anything from them. Not even oil or parts. I would rather drive farther to another dealer. I have done this in the past to avoid a nearby shady dealer that I had a bad experience with. Hopefully, dealers like this shut themselves down after they try screwing enough people and word travels. I'm glad you found a bike for your wife from another source.


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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 8:08 am   #6 (permalink)
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The damage most total a certain amount before it must be disclosed, at least here in Texas. U can get a door ding on a new car and not have to disclose it since that repair may only cost $50 to fix. But hail if claimed on insurance will show on a claim search on the vin. The dealer may have had fedex pay out of pocket for the repair


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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 8:49 am   #7 (permalink)
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Wow!! That's a terrible experience, sorry bro! Even ordering one brand new (including shipping from Italy and all) mine wasn't even close to $17k. That's insane! Glad to hear you guys found a cool one though I can't wait to ride with you guys! Now.. to convince my girlfriend to join the Ducati team
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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 5:40 pm   #8 (permalink)
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I think what that dealer tried to do might be illegal.

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Yep. That is Non-Disclosure. A type of Fraud. Anytime you withhold information that a reasonable buyer would want to know, and that information could/would change the buyers mind if he knew it, then you are guilty of Fraud. Pretty sure that is always a Felony in the case of motor vehicles. Or maybe its when value of the object is over $500, I don't remember exactly.
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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 6:03 pm   #9 (permalink)
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Ok, so he wasn't a used car salesman... but they are practically the same thing.
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Old Dec 13th, 2012, 6:05 pm   #10 (permalink)
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Yep. That is Non-Disclosure. A type of Fraud. Anytime you withhold information that a reasonable buyer would want to know, and that information could/would change the buyers mind if he knew it, then you are guilty of Fraud. Pretty sure that is always a Felony in the case of motor vehicles. Or maybe its when value of the object is over $500, I don't remember exactly.
Except of course the OP's damages are zero because he found out and didn't buy the bike. Also, notwithstanding that you are confusing civil and criminal actions, fraud is a pretty high standard to meet.
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